Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed. gov

Political discussions
User avatar
Skjellyfetti
Anal
Anal
Posts: 14681
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:56 pm
I am a fan of: Appalachian

Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed. gov

Post by Skjellyfetti »

What would be the conservative argument against this?

I'm not talking about the way it may be done (executive order) - but, why would conservatives be opposed to this government transparency and anti-corruption?

Also, I'd imagine this would hurt Hillary worst of all... :D
WASHINGTON — President Obama is seriously considering an executive order that would require companies doing business with the federal government to disclose their political contributions, White House officials said on Tuesday, a step long awaited by activists to reduce the influence of secretive corporate donations in elections.

The directive, known as the “dark money” executive order, would mandate that government contractors publicly report their contributions to groups that spend money to influence campaigns. Advocates inside and outside the White House believe the executive order would prompt some companies to spend less, by exposing their donations to public scrutiny.

Mr. Obama has been considering the action for more than a year, but discussions have intensified in recent weeks, according to activists and administration officials, as the president moves to deliver on unfulfilled promises in his final year in office.

Brandi Hoffine, a White House spokeswoman, declined to comment on internal deliberations, and officials said no final decisions had been made.

“While we will continue to examine additional steps we can take to reduce the corrosive influence of money in politics, only Congress can put an end to it,” Ms. Hoffine said. She noted that legislation to require companies to reveal their campaign giving, known as the Disclose Act, died in 2012 amid Republican opposition.

The idea behind the order is to expose the political activity of many of the country’s largest companies, an attempt to narrow the floodgates of corporate contributions that opened with the Supreme Court’s Citizens United ruling in 2010, which allowed companies and labor unions to give unlimited sums.

In a report last spring, Public Citizen Congress Watch estimated that the proposed directive would apply to 70 percent of Fortune 100 companies, noting that large ones including Exxon Mobil, Apple, General Motors and General Electric had federal contracts worth more than $100,000 over the previous year.

Business groups that have fiercely opposed campaign finance restrictions argue that the executive order would encroach on free speech rights. And some advocates have privately questioned whether the directive would be enforceable.

“The real goal of the disclosure proponents is to harass, intimidate and silence those with whom they disagree,” said Blair Latoff Holmes, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. “We continue to believe that one’s political activities should play no role in whether or not you get or keep a federal contract, and we encourage the administration to leave this bad idea right where it is.”

But outside groups that have long pressed for Mr. Obama to act on his own believe the moment is close at hand. In his State of the Union address last week, the president made a lengthy plea to “fix our politics,” specifically calling for reducing the role of money in campaigns and denying “hidden interests” the ability to bankroll elections.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/20/us/pr ... gifts.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"The unmasking thing was all created by Devin Nunes"
- Richard Burr, (R-NC)
Ivytalk
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 26827
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 pm
I am a fan of: Salisbury University
Location: Republic of Western Sussex

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Ivytalk »

The quote from the U.S. Chamber gets it right.

/thread
“I’m tired and done.” — 89Hen 3/27/22.
User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 25486
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by CID1990 »

There would obviously be both benefits and drawbacks, but I'll have to agree with the Chamber on this one as well. Too much room for political favoritism in a government already known for political favoritism. In fact, it reminds me precisely of how things work here in Nigeria.
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

Ivytalk wrote:The quote from the U.S. Chamber gets it right.

/thread
U.S. Chamber of Commerce...everything that's wrong with US economics under one roof. :dunce: :lol:

Image

“The real goal of the disclosure proponents is to harass, intimidate and silence those with whom they disagree,” said Blair Latoff Holmes, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. “We continue to believe that one’s political activities should play no role in whether or not you get or keep a federal contract, and we encourage the administration to leave this bad idea right where it is.”
EXACTLY! :clap:
Image
Image
Image
Ivytalk
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 26827
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 pm
I am a fan of: Salisbury University
Location: Republic of Western Sussex

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Ivytalk »

kalm wrote:
Ivytalk wrote:The quote from the U.S. Chamber gets it right.

/thread
U.S. Chamber of Commerce...everything that's wrong with US economics under one roof. :dunce: :lol:

Image

“The real goal of the disclosure proponents is to harass, intimidate and silence those with whom they disagree,” said Blair Latoff Holmes, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. “We continue to believe that one’s political activities should play no role in whether or not you get or keep a federal contract, and we encourage the administration to leave this bad idea right where it is.”
EXACTLY! :clap:
So you agree with them. :coffee: If you liked Lois Lerner, klam, you'll love this clusterfvck of an idea.
“I’m tired and done.” — 89Hen 3/27/22.
User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 25486
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by CID1990 »

Ivytalk wrote:
kalm wrote:
U.S. Chamber of Commerce...everything that's wrong with US economics under one roof. :dunce: :lol:

Image




EXACTLY! :clap:
So you agree with them. :coffee: If you liked Lois Lerner, klam, you'll love this clusterfvck of an idea.
klam, et al. have no problem with Lois' behavior
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

Ivytalk wrote:
kalm wrote:
U.S. Chamber of Commerce...everything that's wrong with US economics under one roof. :dunce: :lol:

Image




EXACTLY! :clap:
So you agree with them. :coffee: If you liked Lois Lerner, klam, you'll love this clusterfvck of an idea.
Yeah! We shouldn't have transparency in government because it might lead....to politics! :dunce:

(I think there's been an outbreak of dumb in Nigeria and it's now spreading to Delaware :hide: )
Image
Image
Image
User avatar
Chizzang
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19274
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:36 am
I am a fan of: Deflate Gate
A.K.A.: The Quasar Kid
Location: Palermo Italy

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Chizzang »

There should always be complete transparency of Political monies
There's too much secret money moving already - follow the money should be as easy as ABC

Show me a political figure against this and I'll show you somebody with something to hide...
and of course the Chamber of Commerce is against it
Nobody wants to play poker with all the cards facing up


:rofl:
Q: Name something that offends Republicans?
A: The actual teachings of Jesus
User avatar
Pwns
Level4
Level4
Posts: 7344
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 10:38 pm
I am a fan of: Georgia Friggin' Southern
A.K.A.: FCS_pwns_FBS (AGS)

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Pwns »

It's adorable that people think that just shining light on this stuff is somehow going to clean up politics. As if there's any shame in being involved in quid pro quos in today's politics. :lol:

Example: The situation with Nancy Pelosi's husband's company benefitting from government subsidies. That's not going to keep even San Francisco occupy liberals from re-electing her every time, so why would it really have any effect nation wide?

All this will do is create more opportunities for favoritism without actually fixing the favoritism it's supposed to fix.
Celebrate Diversity.*
*of appearance only. Restrictions apply.
User avatar
Chizzang
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19274
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:36 am
I am a fan of: Deflate Gate
A.K.A.: The Quasar Kid
Location: Palermo Italy

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Chizzang »

Pwns wrote:It's adorable that people think that just shining light on this stuff is somehow going to clean up politics. As if there's any shame in being involved in quid pro quos in today's politics. :lol:

Example: The situation with Nancy Pelosi's husband's company benefitting from government subsidies. That's not going to keep even San Francisco occupy liberals from re-electing her every time, so why would it really have any effect nation wide?

All this will do is create more opportunities for favoritism without actually fixing the favoritism it's supposed to fix.
It kinda comes down to
You either believe secret money is good and works for the benefit of the system
or you believe it hurts the system

To your comment:
Focusing on hitting a home run every at bat does not make you a better hitter
Focusing on having good at bats regardless of the outcome makes you better

Transparency (ultimately) is an imperative to getting better and being better for all
Secrecy doesn't get us there
Q: Name something that offends Republicans?
A: The actual teachings of Jesus
User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 25486
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by CID1990 »

kalm wrote:
Ivytalk wrote: So you agree with them. :coffee: If you liked Lois Lerner, klam, you'll love this clusterfvck of an idea.
Yeah! We shouldn't have transparency in government because it might lead....to politics! :dunce:

(I think there's been an outbreak of dumb in Nigeria and it's now spreading to Delaware :hide: )
Let me repeat (sort of) for you directional schoolers

I see benefits to unmasking corporate donations

But by default I distrust the government (with good reason) and know for a fact that government tits I mean contracts would ebb and flow from left to right depending on who is in the drivers seat

secret money is also bad - I just see it as the lesser of two evils
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris
User avatar
JohnStOnge
Egalitarian
Egalitarian
Posts: 20316
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:47 pm
I am a fan of: McNeese State
A.K.A.: JohnStOnge

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by JohnStOnge »

I don't see secret money or any other money in politics as bad. I frankly am amazed that in what is supposed to be a free country so many people want to restrict the support a person or a business can give to the candidates of their choice.

Even to the extent of people who want to make all candidates completely dependent on government for their financing. Like it's not obvious that there are serious potential problems with that.
Well, I believe that I must tell the truth
And say things as they really are
But if I told the truth and nothing but the truth
Could I ever be a star?

Deep Purple: No One Came
Image
User avatar
Chizzang
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19274
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:36 am
I am a fan of: Deflate Gate
A.K.A.: The Quasar Kid
Location: Palermo Italy

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Chizzang »

JohnStOnge wrote:I don't see secret money or any other money in politics as bad. I frankly am amazed that in what is supposed to be a free country so many people want to restrict the support a person or a business can give to the candidates of their choice.

Even to the extent of people who want to make all candidates completely dependent on government for their financing. Like it's not obvious that there are serious potential problems with that.
Nobody here is arguing against political money
We're arguing against hiding political money
As long as money is power and money sways decisions - it should be completely transparent

Try to pay attention John
Q: Name something that offends Republicans?
A: The actual teachings of Jesus
User avatar
JohnStOnge
Egalitarian
Egalitarian
Posts: 20316
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:47 pm
I am a fan of: McNeese State
A.K.A.: JohnStOnge

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by JohnStOnge »

Nobody here is arguing against political money
We're arguing against hiding political money
As long as money is power and money sways decisions - it should be completely transparent

Try to pay attention John
I am paying attention. Why do you think you have a right to know how much money somebody else gives to a candidate?
Well, I believe that I must tell the truth
And say things as they really are
But if I told the truth and nothing but the truth
Could I ever be a star?

Deep Purple: No One Came
Image
User avatar
Chizzang
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19274
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:36 am
I am a fan of: Deflate Gate
A.K.A.: The Quasar Kid
Location: Palermo Italy

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Chizzang »

JohnStOnge wrote:
Nobody here is arguing against political money
We're arguing against hiding political money
As long as money is power and money sways decisions - it should be completely transparent

Try to pay attention John
I am paying attention. Why do you think you have a right to know how much money somebody else gives to a candidate?
What............????????????
Because it might change how I vote

Example:
If planned parenthood had a bake sale and donated $50K to some politician
you would NEVER vote for that person

Nobody is saying you can't donate
But POLITICS IS MONEY and public service mixed together
and the PUBLIC has the RIGHT to know every dollar
Transparency is necessary and the fact that this is even a discussion
should be embarrassing for the lot of you clowns


:ohno:
Q: Name something that offends Republicans?
A: The actual teachings of Jesus
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

JohnStOnge wrote:
Nobody here is arguing against political money
We're arguing against hiding political money
As long as money is power and money sways decisions - it should be completely transparent

Try to pay attention John
I am paying attention. Why do you think you have a right to know how much money somebody else gives to a candidate?
You can't possibly be this naive. :tothehand:
Image
Image
Image
Ivytalk
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 26827
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 pm
I am a fan of: Salisbury University
Location: Republic of Western Sussex

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Ivytalk »

Full disclosure is a fair exchange for unlimited donations by natural persons and corporations. Free speech, ya know! :thumb:
“I’m tired and done.” — 89Hen 3/27/22.
User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 25486
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by CID1990 »

Ivytalk wrote:Full disclosure is a fair exchange for unlimited donations by natural persons and corporations. Free speech, ya know! :thumb:
/thread
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

Ivytalk wrote:Full disclosure is a fair exchange for unlimited donations by natural persons and corporations. Free speech, ya know! :thumb:
Why are you separating the two? :suspicious:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Ivytalk
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 26827
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 pm
I am a fan of: Salisbury University
Location: Republic of Western Sussex

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by Ivytalk »

kalm wrote:
Ivytalk wrote:Full disclosure is a fair exchange for unlimited donations by natural persons and corporations. Free speech, ya know! :thumb:
Why are you separating the two? :suspicious:

Image
I hate reruns. :coffee:
“I’m tired and done.” — 89Hen 3/27/22.
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

Ivytalk wrote:
kalm wrote:
Why are you separating the two? :suspicious:

Image
I hate reruns. :coffee:
Cuz ya got nuttin'! :kisswink: :mrgreen:
Image
Image
Image
User avatar
UNI88
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 30513
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 8:30 am
I am a fan of: UNI
Location: Sailing the Gulf of Mexico

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by UNI88 »

CID1990 wrote:
kalm wrote:
Yeah! We shouldn't have transparency in government because it might lead....to politics! :dunce:

(I think there's been an outbreak of dumb in Nigeria and it's now spreading to Delaware :hide: )
Let me repeat (sort of) for you directional schoolers

I see benefits to unmasking corporate donations

But by default I distrust the government (with good reason) and know for a fact that government tits I mean contracts would ebb and flow from left to right depending on who is in the drivers seat

secret money is also bad - I just see it as the lesser of two evils
Transparency is great in a vacuum and there are valid arguments both ways but CID pretty much sums up my concerns.

And for those on the left, if transparency is the goal why stop with financial contributions? Shouldn't unions also be required to track and report all of the time that their members spend supporting a candidate? You know what they say - "time is money."
Being wrong about a topic is called post partisanism - kalm

MAQA - putting the Q into qrazy qanon qult qonspiracy theories since 2015.

It will probably be difficult for MAQA yahoos to overcome the Qult programming but they should give being rational & reasonable a try.

Thank you for your attention to this matter - UNI88
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

UNI88 wrote:
CID1990 wrote:
Let me repeat (sort of) for you directional schoolers

I see benefits to unmasking corporate donations

But by default I distrust the government (with good reason) and know for a fact that government tits I mean contracts would ebb and flow from left to right depending on who is in the drivers seat

secret money is also bad - I just see it as the lesser of two evils
Transparency is great in a vacuum and there are valid arguments both ways but CID pretty much sums up my concerns.

And for those on the left, if transparency is the goal why stop with financial contributions? Shouldn't unions also be required to track and report all of the time that their members spend supporting a candidate? You know what they say - "time is money."
Transparency is great period. And yes, unions should be held accountable as well.
Image
Image
Image
User avatar
JohnStOnge
Egalitarian
Egalitarian
Posts: 20316
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:47 pm
I am a fan of: McNeese State
A.K.A.: JohnStOnge

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by JohnStOnge »

You can't possibly be this naive.
It's not being naive. It's having respect for people being free to interact with each other without having government force them to advertise it.

If somebody favors the position Planned Parenthood favors (to refer back to another post), you're going to know it if you're paying attention. Planned Parenthood would be giving them the donations because they will have a record of actions and statements leading Planned Parenthood to think it's in their interest to support them.

If money buys elections the People have nobody to blame for that but themselves. They complain about money in politics yet they respond by allowing themselves to be influenced by political advertising. Just like they complain about negative ads but then when politicians use negative ads they work because people respond to them.

"Money in Politics" is one of those things people complain about but it's not the problem. If there's some reason to believe someone was effectively bribed then that can be looked into. But there's no real reason to require that people who give money to candidates' campaigns in order to support them being elected be forced to identify themselves publicly if they don't want to.
Well, I believe that I must tell the truth
And say things as they really are
But if I told the truth and nothing but the truth
Could I ever be a star?

Deep Purple: No One Came
Image
kalm
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 69119
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:36 pm
I am a fan of: Eastern
A.K.A.: Humus The Proud
Location: Northern Palouse

Re: Disclosing donations for companies in business with fed.

Post by kalm »

JohnStOnge wrote:
You can't possibly be this naive.
It's not being naive. It's having respect for people being free to interact with each other without having government force them to advertise it.

If somebody favors the position Planned Parenthood favors (to refer back to another post), you're going to know it if you're paying attention. Planned Parenthood would be giving them the donations because they will have a record of actions and statements leading Planned Parenthood to think it's in their interest to support them.

If money buys elections the People have nobody to blame for that but themselves. They complain about money in politics yet they respond by allowing themselves to be influenced by political advertising. Just like they complain about negative ads but then when politicians use negative ads they work because people respond to them.

"Money in Politics" is one of those things people complain about but it's not the problem. If there's some reason to believe someone was effectively bribed then that can be looked into. But there's no real reason to require that people who give money to candidates' campaigns in order to support them being elected be forced to identify themselves publicly if they don't want to.
Money buys access and decides winners. It is way more important than track record or ideas. To argue against that is naive or disingenuous.

Regarding the topic at hand, the public has a right to know who is influencing government contracts. You're simply hiding bribery behind the curtain of alleged constitutional rights. Do you really think the founders would be on the side of money is speech and corporations are people? Way to twist and turn original intent. :ohno:
Image
Image
Image
Post Reply