On the Idea that the Democratic Primaries were "Rigged"

[kalm]

"I'm afraid of political speech".

You're either dishonest or projecting.

Btw, Nicleback has sold over 50 million albums.

Sorry, you still lose...

Nickelback is Canadian, those Canucks will buy anything. Album sales are thus inadmissible as proof of them being "cutting edge". Point to me.

As for you being afraid of political speech, there's nothing dishonest about that, that's your casus belli. You think any possibility of people hearing and believing something you don't agree with (since you're the arbiter of all things right and just in the world) is anathema and therefore must be squelched at all costs. Sure, political speech and the freedom of it is fine, as long as you agree with it. Otherwise we should do all that we can, and create laws if need be, to protect the poor innocent and gullible voters who may make up their own mind and believe something you don't (which they will only do because of money, not because they could actually agree with it). That's what ultimately betrays your false pronouncement to be a moderate in things political, you don't really see value in the other side of an argument, you see an argument that is only floated by some evil financial backing, just because you don't agree with it. Open your mind, explore the possibility of being wrong from time to time and readjusting as a result of it, you'll be a better kalm for it. Oh, and have faith in the voters, they screw up from time to time but generally do alright.

Oh man....

Exchange all the you's, yours, and you're's with I's, me's, and my's from your stalker/projection rant and we see why YOU have trouble even admitting YOU're wrong about Nicleback...

Nickle back is one of the most commercially successful Canadian groups, having sold more than 50 million albums worldwide[1] and ranking as the eleventh best-selling music act, and the second best-selling foreign act in the U.S. of the 2000s, behind The Beatles.[2][3] Billboard ranks them the most successful rock group of the decade; their song "How You Remind Me" was listed as the best-selling rock song of the decade and the fourth best-selling of the decade. They were listed number seven on the Billboard top artist of the decade, with four albums listed on the Billboard top albums of the decade.[4]

[GannonFan]

Nickelback is Canadian, those Canucks will buy anything. Album sales are thus inadmissible as proof of them being "cutting edge". Point to me.

As for you being afraid of political speech, there's nothing dishonest about that, that's your casus belli. You think any possibility of people hearing and believing something you don't agree with (since you're the arbiter of all things right and just in the world) is anathema and therefore must be squelched at all costs. Sure, political speech and the freedom of it is fine, as long as you agree with it. Otherwise we should do all that we can, and create laws if need be, to protect the poor innocent and gullible voters who may make up their own mind and believe something you don't (which they will only do because of money, not because they could actually agree with it). That's what ultimately betrays your false pronouncement to be a moderate in things political, you don't really see value in the other side of an argument, you see an argument that is only floated by some evil financial backing, just because you don't agree with it. Open your mind, explore the possibility of being wrong from time to time and readjusting as a result of it, you'll be a better kalm for it. Oh, and have faith in the voters, they screw up from time to time but generally do alright.

Oh man....

Exchange all the you's, yours, and you're's with I's, me's, and my's from your stalker/projection rant and we see why YOU have trouble even admitting YOU're wrong about Nicleback...

Nickle back is one of the most commercially successful Canadian groups, having sold more than 50 million albums worldwide[1] and ranking as the eleventh best-selling music act, and the second best-selling foreign act in the U.S. of the 2000s, behind The Beatles.[2][3] Billboard ranks them the most successful rock group of the decade; their song "How You Remind Me" was listed as the best-selling rock song of the decade and the fourth best-selling of the decade. They were listed number seven on the Billboard top artist of the decade, with four albums listed on the Billboard top albums of the decade.[4]

Ah yes, your version of the white flag, yet again. No worries.

And yes, you have a strange fascination with Nickelback. Thanks for illuminating us with that.

[kalm]

Oh man....

Exchange all the you's, yours, and you're's with I's, me's, and my's from your stalker/projection rant and we see why YOU have trouble even admitting YOU're wrong about Nicleback...

Ah yes, your version of the white flag, yet again. No worries.

And yes, you have a strange fascination with Nickelback. Thanks for illuminating us with that.

I was one and done with my excellent Nickelback analogy. You chose to press and get proven wrong. Hey...why don't you pull out the 'Kalm likes the 1950's'? I love that one and there's even now a thread about it!

[houndawg]

More intellectual dishonesty. Surprise!

Go back to my original points. Hint: you're sort of agreeing with one here...that people live in their own bubbles and are susceptible to propaganda.

1). Marketing is effective and people are susceptible to it. If you have enough money, you can even convince them that Bud Light is flavorful and Nicleback is cutting edge.

2). Elections are not won by ideas but by promotion. The more money you have, the easier it gets.

Start there and see if you still disagree. Then we can move on to remedies.

Another hint: new media is also driven by money.

Best of luck!

Money isn't the driver, money follows what works. Yes, elections are won by promotion (which can include ideas), but money doesn't make a bad promotion work. Think New Coke. Plenty of money there, didn't work. You're fixated on money so you can't see that. The person who wins an election is normally the person who had the most money in the end, but that's because people like betting on a winner, the bettors don't make the winner. Oh, and that goes for new media as well. Facebook, twitter, et al, succeeded first as a promotion or an idea, and then the money came rolling in.

Oh, and what I said was surely intellectual, no argument there, but where was the dishonesty? Examples please.

Oh, and no amount of money has made enough people really think Nickelback is cutting edge. That example actually proves my point, money can sell a bad promotion.

"Money is the mother's milk of politics." Tip O'Neil.

[GannonFan]

Money isn't the driver, money follows what works. Yes, elections are won by promotion (which can include ideas), but money doesn't make a bad promotion work. Think New Coke. Plenty of money there, didn't work. You're fixated on money so you can't see that. The person who wins an election is normally the person who had the most money in the end, but that's because people like betting on a winner, the bettors don't make the winner. Oh, and that goes for new media as well. Facebook, twitter, et al, succeeded first as a promotion or an idea, and then the money came rolling in.

Oh, and what I said was surely intellectual, no argument there, but where was the dishonesty? Examples please.

Oh, and no amount of money has made enough people really think Nickelback is cutting edge. That example actually proves my point, money can sell a bad promotion.

"Money is the mother's milk of politics." Tip O'Neil.

No doubt, no one's disputing that. My contention is that money follows winners, it doesn't create winners out of losers. Betting people like to win, hence why you don't see tons of money dropped on long shots. Same with political donors.

[GannonFan]

Ah yes, your version of the white flag, yet again. No worries.

And yes, you have a strange fascination with Nickelback. Thanks for illuminating us with that.

I was one and done with my excellent Nickelback analogy. You chose to press and get proven wrong. Hey...why don't you pull out the 'Kalm likes the 1950's'? I love that one and there's even now a thread about it!

Nah, you're just doubling down on the "I'm rubber and you're glue" or the "I know what you are but what am I" strategy. Very ingenious of you, it does help to skirt around details, which tends to be something you like to gloss over.