Trump and Clinton polling at 9%

[Gil Dobie]

And why do you think that is? Do you believe Trump is a more valid and reasoned candidate than Johnson?

(Keep coming...you're getting there!)

I think Johnson is pretty close to matching Trump for stupidity, so...

I said, I don't disagree that the system is set up to make it hard for a third party to get a foothold. Does anyone disagree with that? But the third party candidates have done nothing to overcome that IMO.

You almost need a major candidate to switch parties, to get momentum for a 3rd party. If Bernie Sanders ran as a third party, he might have a better chance than Trump, to defeat the Clinton machine.

[89Hen]

I think Johnson is pretty close to matching Trump for stupidity, so...

I said, I don't disagree that the system is set up to make it hard for a third party to get a foothold. Does anyone disagree with that? But the third party candidates have done nothing to overcome that IMO.

You almost need a major candidate to switch parties, to get momentum for a 3rd party. If Bernie Sanders ran as a third party, he might have a better chance than Trump, to defeat the Clinton machine.

Yes, but then again, he wouldn't really be a third party candidate, would he?

[Gil Dobie]

You almost need a major candidate to switch parties, to get momentum for a 3rd party. If Bernie Sanders ran as a third party, he might have a better chance than Trump, to defeat the Clinton machine.

Yes, but then again, he wouldn't really be a third party candidate, would he?

I actually think Bernie is left of the Democrat Party, so it depends on the person defining it.

[89Hen]

Yes, but then again, he wouldn't really be a third party candidate, would he?

I actually think Bernie is left of the Democrat Party, so it depends on the person defining it.

I would agree.

[kalm]

Yes, but then again, he wouldn't really be a third party candidate, would he?

I actually think Bernie is left of the Democrat Party, so it depends on the person defining it.

Bernie Sanders for all intents and purposes WAS a 3rd party candidate. He was a democratic socialist garnering a shit ton of support. You could easily make a case that his policies were no less outside the mainstream than Johnson.

[89Hen]

I actually think Bernie is left of the Democrat Party, so it depends on the person defining it.

Bernie Sanders for all intents and purposes WAS a 3rd party candidate. He was a democratic socialist garnering a shit ton of support. You could easily make a case that his policies were no less outside the mainstream than Johnson.

And how'd that work out for him?

[kalm]

Bernie Sanders for all intents and purposes WAS a 3rd party candidate. He was a democratic socialist garnering a shit ton of support. You could easily make a case that his policies were no less outside the mainstream than Johnson.

And how'd that work out for him?

Which proves my point exactly.

[89Hen]

And how'd that work out for him?

Which proves my point exactly.

I don't even know what your point is.

[kalm]

Which proves my point exactly.

I don't even know what your point is.

I'm honestly not sure either.

[Skjellyfetti]

Bernie Sanders for all intents and purposes WAS a 3rd party candidate. He was a democratic socialist garnering a shit ton of support. You could easily make a case that his policies were no less outside the mainstream than Johnson.

And how'd that work out for him?

Pretty damn well.

As kalm said, he was, for an intents and purposes, a 3rd party candidate.

His goal was never to win. His goal was to keep Hillary from running unopposed and setting her own agenda, own issues, etc. He vastly exceeded his own expectations, imo.

Third party candidates (in our system) aren't "in it to win it." Gary Johnson's goal isn't to win the presidency. His short term goal is to poll 15% and get on the debate stage. And, longer term... if he can get just 5% of the vote in November... he opens up equal ballot access and federal funding for the Libertarian Party. 5% isn't a very lofty goal.

Johnson's campaign won't be a failure if he doesn't win. And, Bernie's campaign wasn't a failure since he didn't win, either... imo.

Hillary's campaign, for example, would have been a colossal failure if she didn't win the nomination and a very big failure if she doesn't win the general. See the difference?

[89Hen]

His goal was never to win.

[89Hen]

Johnson nor Stein will crack 4% of the popular vote

I'll take the over on Johnson and the under on Stein.

God I hate being right so damn much.

Moose, Rocco, help the judge find his checkbook.

[Ivytalk]

I stuck with Johnson, notwithstanding his goofiness and his gaffes. And I slept like a baby last night. The LP still reflected my policy preferences better than anyone else, with some key exceptions (religious liberty and abortion, to name two).

By way of comparison, 19% of voters opted for Ross Perot -- a rich paranoid "strongman" if ever there was one -- back in 1992, and he didn't even have a platform, other than "Ross the Boss will fix it." Sound familiar?

[Gil Dobie]

That's the percentage of eligible voters who actually voted for them in the primaries.

And I'm guessing both parties are more than fine with this fact.

But keep on mocking the idea of 3rd parties....losers.

I'm not sure mocking is the right word. So far, there hasn't been a third party worthy of my vote and I do think there are inherit problems with a third party making much headway. The fact that there are only 9% of eligible voters who actually voted for them in the primaries and Johnson nor Stein will crack 4% of the popular vote kind of renders your post somewhat faulty.

Evan McMullin got 20 percent in his home state of Utah.

[Ivytalk]

I'm not sure mocking is the right word. So far, there hasn't been a third party worthy of my vote and I do think there are inherit problems with a third party making much headway. The fact that there are only 9% of eligible voters who actually voted for them in the primaries and Johnson nor Stein will crack 4% of the popular vote kind of renders your post somewhat faulty.

Evan McMullin got 20 percent in his home state of Utah.

And practically zero non-Mormon votes anywhere else.

[93henfan]

I'll take the over on Johnson and the under on Stein.

God I hate being right so damn much.

Moose, Rocco, help the judge find his checkbook.

[Gil Dobie]

Evan McMullin got 20 percent in his home state of Utah.

And practically zero non-Mormon votes anywhere else.

If it's done right, a third party can make headway. Just need the right combination of circumstance and platform to get votes across the nation.

[Ibanez]

I'll take the over on Johnson and the under on Stein.

God I hate being right so damn much.

Moose, Rocco, help the judge find his checkbook.

You have to admit, he did much better than 2012. 0.99% to 3%. More than doubled what he pulled previously. We're on our way...

[GannonFan]

God I hate being right so damn much.

Moose, Rocco, help the judge find his checkbook.

You have to admit, he did much better than 2012. 0.99% to 3%. More than doubled what he pulled previously. We're on our way...

If Perot couldn't get it started back in the '90's it never will. A third party is always transitory anyway, so even if it showed up it would disappear again very soon. Trump is the perfect example why - who needs a third party when you can crash one of the existing two parties?

[CAA Flagship]

And practically zero non-Mormon votes anywhere else.

If it's done right, a third party can make headway. Just need the right combination of circumstance and platform to get votes across the nation.

I'll say it again. Can't build it from the top down. Gotta be from the bottom up.

[CAA Flagship]

You have to admit, he did much better than 2012. 0.99% to 3%. More than doubled what he pulled previously. We're on our way...

If Perot couldn't get it started back in the '90's it never will. A third party is always transitory anyway, so even if it showed up it would disappear again very soon. Trump is the perfect example why - who needs a third party when you can crash one of the existing two parties?

Trump was in a perfect storm. And I mean perfect, for his message and approach. He nearly blew it.

[Ivytalk]

If it's done right, a third party can make headway. Just need the right combination of circumstance and platform to get votes across the nation.

I'll say it again. Can't build it from the top down. Gotta be from the bottom up.

The Libertarians have been trying that for years, but stupid ideological fights keep holding them back. Would you want an anarchist faction?

[YoUDeeMan]

0.99% to 3%. More than doubled what he pulled previously.

There is a more accurate word for that increase. It comes after, "double" and is synonymous in baseball with a three-bagger. What would that word be...hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

[Ibanez]

If it's done right, a third party can make headway. Just need the right combination of circumstance and platform to get votes across the nation.

I'll say it again. Can't build it from the top down. Gotta be from the bottom up.

Exactly. Let the libertarians or barking spiders win a few state legislatures or congressional seats.

[Ibanez]

0.99% to 3%. More than doubled what he pulled previously.

There is a more accurate word for that increase. It comes after, "double" and is synonymous in baseball with a three-bagger. What would that word be...hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

I didn't have the exact numbers...he more than tripled. Well done. 1,275,971 to 4,032,647.