As with homosexuality, it's happening again

[JohnStOnge]

And I hadn't noticed until I saw a bunch of clips of Trump's last nominee for Army Secretary saying transgender is a disease in a context suggesting he was saying something irrational. First thing I thought is, "It IS still recognized as a disease. It's called 'gender identity disorder."'

So I Googled "gender identity disorder" and immediately saw that the process of declaring, due to political and philosophical considerations, that it's not a disorder is well underway. "Disorder" had been removed from the name. Now it's been renamed "gender dysphoria."

Then I found an article from a site called "TeenVogue.com":

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/trumps-a ... -a-disease

A quote:

Green is wrong.

In 2012, the American Psychiatric Association removed the term “gender identity disorder” from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), reclassifying it as gender dysphoria.

That sentence has a link in it that takes you to an article in "Advocate." This quote is in that one:

For years advocates have lobbied the American Psychiatric Association to change or remove categories labeling transgender people in a psychiatric manual, arguing that terms like “Gender Identity Disorder” characterize all trans people as mentally ill.

So there you have it. It's happening again in the current context. A condition historically identified as a disorder is being reclassified so that it will no longer be considered as such. And it's not happening because of any change in the science. It's happening because of political/philosophical advocacy. Because people are pushing for it because they want official validation of their denial of the reality that there is something wrong with you if you are born a male but want to think you're a female or visa versa.

BTW I'm not sure the process is complete. I found an American Psychiatric Association discussion of it at https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-fam ... -dysphoria. I read it as saying gender dysphoria is still considered a disorder. I say that because it contrasts the condition to "gender nonconformity" while saying "gender nonconformity is not a disorder."

And it has "Diagnosis" section including this language:

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) provides for one overarching diagnosis of gender dysphoria with separate specific criteria for children and for adolescents and adults.

But if I'm correct in interpreting the article as indicating it's still recognized as a disorder I think it's just a matter of time before it's not. The political/philosophical wheels are turning.

One last thing: I see many things that make me cynical about the fields of Psychiatry and Psychology and here's another one from that American Psychiatric Association page:

In adolescents and adults gender dysphoria diagnosis involves a difference between one’s experienced/expressed gender and assigned gender,

I've seen that before. In fact I took a survey that asked me what gender I was "assigned" at birth.

The implication is complete nonsense. With very rare exceptions such as those involving people born with both male and female genitalia (intersex), we are not "assigned" a "gender" at birth. Way over 99% of us are born clearly and unequivocally male or clearly and unequivocally female. Nobody "assigns" that to us. It's inherent. We are no more "assigned" gender at birth than I "assigned" marine animals their sex years ago when I did surveys as a State biologist and counted males and females to estimate sex rations. It's like saying a pine tree was "assigned" to be a pine tree. Like the only reason I was categorized as a male is that some Doctor flipped a coin and decided that's what I'd be.

Use of that kind of terminology..."assigned gender"...in one more thing that makes me think the field of Psychiatry has been irrevocably contaminated by philosophical/political pressure and/or bias.

[houndawg]

And I hadn't noticed until I saw a bunch of clips of Trump's last nominee for Army Secretary saying transgender is a disease in a context suggesting he was saying something irrational. First thing I thought is, "It IS still recognized as a disease. It's called 'gender identity disorder."'

So I Googled "gender identity disorder" and immediately saw that the process of declaring, due to political and philosophical considerations, that it's not a disorder is well underway. "Disorder" had been removed from the name. Now it's been renamed "gender dysphoria."

Then I found an article from a site called "TeenVogue.com":

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/trumps-a ... -a-disease

A quote:

Green is wrong.

In 2012, the American Psychiatric Association removed the term “gender identity disorder” from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), reclassifying it as gender dysphoria.

That sentence has a link in it that takes you to an article in "Advocate." This quote is in that one:

For years advocates have lobbied the American Psychiatric Association to change or remove categories labeling transgender people in a psychiatric manual, arguing that terms like “Gender Identity Disorder” characterize all trans people as mentally ill.

So there you have it. It's happening again in the current context. A condition historically identified as a disorder is being reclassified so that it will no longer be considered as such. And it's not happening because of any change in the science. It's happening because of political/philosophical advocacy. Because people are pushing for it because they want official validation of their denial of the reality that there is something wrong with you if you are born a male but want to think you're a female or visa versa.

BTW I'm not sure the process is complete. I found an American Psychiatric Association discussion of it at https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-fam ... -dysphoria. I read it as saying gender dysphoria is still considered a disorder. I say that because it contrasts the condition to "gender nonconformity" while saying "gender nonconformity is not a disorder."

And it has "Diagnosis" section including this language:

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) provides for one overarching diagnosis of gender dysphoria with separate specific criteria for children and for adolescents and adults.

But if I'm correct in interpreting the article as indicating it's still recognized as a disorder I think it's just a matter of time before it's not. The political/philosophical wheels are turning.

One last thing: I see many things that make me cynical about the fields of Psychiatry and Psychology and here's another one from that American Psychiatric Association page:

In adolescents and adults gender dysphoria diagnosis involves a difference between one’s experienced/expressed gender and assigned gender,

I've seen that before. In fact I took a survey that asked me what gender I was "assigned" at birth.

The implication is complete nonsense. With very rare exceptions such as those involving people born with both male and female genitalia (intersex), we are not "assigned" a "gender" at birth. Way over 99% of us are born clearly and unequivocally male or clearly and unequivocally female. Nobody "assigns" that to us. It's inherent. We are no more "assigned" gender at birth than I "assigned" marine animals their sex years ago when I did surveys as a State biologist and counted males and females to estimate sex rations. It's like saying a pine tree was "assigned" to be a pine tree. Like the only reason I was categorized as a male is that some Doctor flipped a coin and decided that's what I'd be.

Use of that kind of terminology..."assigned gender"...in one more thing that makes me think the field of Psychiatry has been irrevocably contaminated by philosophical/political pressure and/or bias.

You bloviate about the most trivial shit.

[Pwns]

A chick who is a 6 who thinks she's so hideous that everyone is staring at her wherever she goes is "dysphoric". That's not an exaggeration, it happens. Don't get hung up on the word use.

Now a question that can't be ignored is why said chick who is a 6 simply needs psychotherapy to learn to accept themselves but gender-dysphoric people need fake primary and secondary sex characteristics.

[kalm]

And I hadn't noticed until I saw a bunch of clips of Trump's last nominee for Army Secretary saying transgender is a disease in a context suggesting he was saying something irrational. First thing I thought is, "It IS still recognized as a disease. It's called 'gender identity disorder."'

So I Googled "gender identity disorder" and immediately saw that the process of declaring, due to political and philosophical considerations, that it's not a disorder is well underway. "Disorder" had been removed from the name. Now it's been renamed "gender dysphoria."

Then I found an article from a site called "TeenVogue.com":

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/trumps-a ... -a-disease

A quote:

Green is wrong.

In 2012, the American Psychiatric Association removed the term “gender identity disorder” from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), reclassifying it as gender dysphoria.

That sentence has a link in it that takes you to an article in "Advocate." This quote is in that one:

For years advocates have lobbied the American Psychiatric Association to change or remove categories labeling transgender people in a psychiatric manual, arguing that terms like “Gender Identity Disorder” characterize all trans people as mentally ill.

So there you have it. It's happening again in the current context. A condition historically identified as a disorder is being reclassified so that it will no longer be considered as such. And it's not happening because of any change in the science. It's happening because of political/philosophical advocacy. Because people are pushing for it because they want official validation of their denial of the reality that there is something wrong with you if you are born a male but want to think you're a female or visa versa.

BTW I'm not sure the process is complete. I found an American Psychiatric Association discussion of it at https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-fam ... -dysphoria. I read it as saying gender dysphoria is still considered a disorder. I say that because it contrasts the condition to "gender nonconformity" while saying "gender nonconformity is not a disorder."

And it has "Diagnosis" section including this language:

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) provides for one overarching diagnosis of gender dysphoria with separate specific criteria for children and for adolescents and adults.

But if I'm correct in interpreting the article as indicating it's still recognized as a disorder I think it's just a matter of time before it's not. The political/philosophical wheels are turning.

One last thing: I see many things that make me cynical about the fields of Psychiatry and Psychology and here's another one from that American Psychiatric Association page:

In adolescents and adults gender dysphoria diagnosis involves a difference between one’s experienced/expressed gender and assigned gender,

I've seen that before. In fact I took a survey that asked me what gender I was "assigned" at birth.

The implication is complete nonsense. With very rare exceptions such as those involving people born with both male and female genitalia (intersex), we are not "assigned" a "gender" at birth. Way over 99% of us are born clearly and unequivocally male or clearly and unequivocally female. Nobody "assigns" that to us. It's inherent. We are no more "assigned" gender at birth than I "assigned" marine animals their sex years ago when I did surveys as a State biologist and counted males and females to estimate sex rations. It's like saying a pine tree was "assigned" to be a pine tree. Like the only reason I was categorized as a male is that some Doctor flipped a coin and decided that's what I'd be.

Use of that kind of terminology..."assigned gender"...in one more thing that makes me think the field of Psychiatry has been irrevocably contaminated by philosophical/political pressure and/or bias.

It seems like you want to apply hard science to a soft science description. Why label gender identification a disorder, disease, or dysfuntion in the first place? Why do you care so much about how others self-identify? It's harmless.

It’s not easy to determine what is a psychological disorder. The DSM-IV explains, “…the concept of mental disorder (like many other concepts in medicine and science) lacks a consistent operational definition that covers all situations.”

Psychologists define a psychological disorder broadly as psychological dysfunction in an individual that is associated with distress or impairment and a reaction that is not culturally expected. When considering if something is a symptom of a disorder, consider the three Ds: Is it psychologically dysfunctional? Is it distressing or handicapping to the individual or others? Is it associated with a response that is atypical or deviant?

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/th ... l-disorder

[kalm]

The debate burns both ways with the danger being an attempt to control speech and thought. Here's an instance where the Canadian left is bat shit crazy over the issue.

"I've studied authoritarianism for a very long time - for 40 years - and they're started by people's attempts to control the ideological and linguistic territory," he told the BBC.
"There's no way I'm going to use words made up by people who are doing that - not a chance."
Dr Peterson is concerned proposed federal human rights legislation "will elevate into hate speech" his refusal to use alternative pronouns.
Legal experts disagree.
Bill C-16, currently before Canada's parliament, prohibits discrimination under the Canadian Human Rights Act on the basis of gender identity and expression. The bill covers the federal government and federally regulated industries like banks or airlines. It also extends hate speech provisions under Canada's criminal code to transgendered people.
"I don't think any legal expert would say using an inappropriate pronoun, while not something that respects the human rights of trans people, would ever result in a criminal conviction," said Kyle Kirkup, a law professor with the University of Ottawa who specialises in gender identity and sexuality law.
But Dr Peterson could face sanction under Ontario's human rights code, which extended protection to trans people in 2012.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-37875695

This Peterson fellow is really fucking smart. One of the best defenders of conservative values I've ever heard. I've mentioned it before but I strongly suggest listening to or watching his appearance on the Joe Rogan podcast. It's great.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04wyGK6k6HE

[SeattleGriz]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a shit.

[Ivytalk]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a ****.

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

And, John, some Libertarian you are.

[BDKJMU]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a ****.

Good morning sir.

[Chizzang]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a ****.

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

Post of the week...!!!



Ivy I you so much

[CID1990]

I refuse to be affected by other peoples' stupidity if I can help it

If I CAN'T help it, then I try to make myself as offensive as I possibly can


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CAA Flagship]

I refuse to be affected by other peoples' stupidity if I can help it

If I CAN'T help it, then I try to make myself as offensive as I possibly can


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This

Thus the use of the middle finger by NJ drivers.

[SeattleGriz]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a ****.

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

Does that line actually work?! I have to try that.

[Ivytalk]

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

Does that line actually work?! I have to try that.

Not sure. How's your dental work?

[JohnStOnge]

I work in the same building with a newly minted woman and I have no clue what to say to her for fear of saying the wrong thing. I have no ill will, simply don't give a ****.

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

And, John, some Libertarian you are.

I did not say someone should not be allowed to pretend they are not what they are if they want to do that. I did not say government should make it illegal for a man to dress like a woman or visa versa.

What I'm said that the field of psychiatry is in the process of making another decision on the basis of philosophical/political pressure to do so. Psychiatry will remove what we used to call gender identity disorder from its list of disorders and people who resist will be told that "science" has determined that it's not a disorder. But it won't have been science that did it.

[CID1990]

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

And, John, some Libertarian you are.

I did not say someone should not be allowed to pretend they are not what they are if they want to do that. I did not say government should make it illegal for a man to dress like a woman or visa versa.

What I'm said that the field of psychiatry is in the process of making another decision on the basis of philosophical/political pressure to do so. Psychiatry will remove what we used to call gender identity disorder from its list of disorders and people who resist will be told that "science" has determined that it's not a disorder. But it won't have been science that did it.

You're the same guy who has diagnosed Trump as a paychopath


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chizzang]

I did not say someone should not be allowed to pretend they are not what they are if they want to do that. I did not say government should make it illegal for a man to dress like a woman or visa versa.

What I'm said that the field of psychiatry is in the process of making another decision on the basis of philosophical/political pressure to do so. Psychiatry will remove what we used to call gender identity disorder from its list of disorders and people who resist will be told that "science" has determined that it's not a disorder. But it won't have been science that did it.

You're the same guy who has diagnosed Trump as a paychopath

Trump is probably not a "psychopath"
But he's absolutely pathological

[andy7171]

"Nice tits" is a good icebreaker.

And, John, some Libertarian you are.

I did not say someone should not be allowed to pretend they are not what they are if they want to do that. I did not say government should make it illegal for a man to dress like a woman or visa versa.

What I'm said that the field of psychiatry is in the process of making another decision on the basis of philosophical/political pressure to do so. Psychiatry will remove what we used to call gender identity disorder from its list of disorders and people who resist will be told that "science" has determined that it's not a disorder. But it won't have been science that did it.

With that kind of thought, Hillary would put you in one of the Trump Baskets!

[CID1990]

You're the same guy who has diagnosed Trump as a paychopath

Trump is probably not a "psychopath"
But he's absolutely pathological

No dispute there

I'm just amused that a guy who correctly says psychology isn't a science is more than willing to pretend it's a science when it comes to Trump

[JohnStOnge]

Trump is probably not a "psychopath"
But he's absolutely pathological

No dispute there

I'm just amused that a guy who correctly says psychology isn't a science is more than willing to pretend it's a science when it comes to Trump

I didn't say psychology isn't a science. I consider it to be a "soft" science. But it is a science.

And I do think there is such a thing as mental illness. Psychiatry and psychology are the fields that deal with that.

What I'm saying is that this is an example of a community of professionals in a particular field of science being corrupted by political/philosophical concerns.

[CID1990]

No dispute there

I'm just amused that a guy who correctly says psychology isn't a science is more than willing to pretend it's a science when it comes to Trump

I didn't say psychology isn't a science. I consider it to be a "soft" science. But it is a science.

And I do think there is such a thing as mental illness. Psychiatry and psychology are the fields that deal with that.

What I'm saying is that this is an example of a community of professionals in a particular field of science being corrupted by political/philosophical concerns.

Your mental gymnastics er, I mean evolution on this subject is more entertaining than any tv series

Maybe AMC or SyFy will pick you up

[JohnStOnge]

Your mental gymnastics er, I mean evolution on this subject is more entertaining than any tv series

Maybe AMC or SyFy will pick you up

I don't think I ever said the fields of psychiatry and psychology are not sciences. If you can show me where I did then that will be that. If I said it I said it. But I'd be surprised if I said it because I do consider them to be "soft" sciences.

Now, I have said that they are afflicted by an egalitarian bias and that they have taken positions based on philosophy rather than science. No doubt about that. And that's what I was doing in starting this thread.