Arizona Moves to Allow Concealed Guns in Bars

[dbackjon]

I can drink, and you can sit next to me, and be unaffected.

That's not what you said in the past. What if he drinks a 6 pack?

Appaholic can drink all the beer in the world and not affect me, unless he on me

[bobbythekidd]

[Pwns]

Bad, bad idea.

Even off duty cops in most jurisdictions aren't allowed to carry when they are patronizing establishments where alcohol is the chief item of sale. If I were a club owner I would ban concealed weapons on my property.

Personally, with my libertarian leanings, I believe this is how it should be dealt with....don't outlaw, but allow the club owners to make the call....use it as a marketing ploy....if people aren't comfortable patronizing an establishment which allows CC, then the club won't make it....feel the same way about cigarettes as well...

Bingo

Not that I buy into all this stuff about guns in bars becoming more dangerous. People have said that allowing CCP folks to carry guns on college campuses would mean shootouts all over campus but among the 11 universities that permit students with CCP there hasn't even been so much as 1 accident. We've serisouly got a bad case of irrational gunphobia in this country.

[wkuhillhound]

Tennessee had a similar that was vetoed by the governor but was overridden by the legislature. UGH!!!
Tennessee is also trying to pass legislature to make it legal to have a weapon in national parks. Disgusting.

Personally I think it is a ignoramous idea. Violence begets violence plain and simple. Even if you are a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't feel safe with anyone carry a handgun. It is ludicrous. Law abiding citizens become criminals in an instant. It's a no-win situation.

[bobbythekidd]

Tennessee had a similar that was vetoed by the governor but was overridden by the legislature. UGH!!!
Tennessee is also trying to pass legislature to make it legal to have a weapon in national parks. Disgusting.

Personally I think it is a ignoramous idea. Violence begets violence plain and simple. Even if you are a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't feel safe with anyone carry a handgun. It is ludicrous. Law abiding citizens become criminals in an instant. It's a no-win situation.

Did I just read that correctly?

[grizzaholic]

Tennessee had a similar that was vetoed by the governor but was overridden by the legislature. UGH!!!
Tennessee is also trying to pass legislature to make it legal to have a weapon in national parks. Disgusting.

Personally I think it is a ignoramous idea. Violence begets violence plain and simple. Even if you are a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't feel safe with anyone carry a handgun. It is ludicrous. Law abiding citizens become criminals in an instant. It's a no-win situation.

You are officially nuts. What kind of backwards logic is that?

And what is the big fucking deal with allowing guns in parks? People will not be hunting, target shooting. They will be SELF-FUCKING-Defense.

[grizzaholic]

I guess cops, and our military are all criminals than.

[Grizalltheway]

Tennessee had a similar that was vetoed by the governor but was overridden by the legislature. UGH!!!
Tennessee is also trying to pass legislature to make it legal to have a weapon in national parks. Disgusting.

Personally I think it is a ignoramous idea. Violence begets violence plain and simple. Even if you are a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't feel safe with anyone carry a handgun. It is ludicrous. Law abiding citizens become criminals in an instant. It's a no-win situation.

You are officially nuts. What kind of backwards logic is that?

And what is the big fucking deal with allowing guns in parks? People will not be hunting, target shooting. They will be SELF-FUCKING-Defense.

You give people too much credit, Grizza. Have you ever looked at road signs on mountain roads? Just because you wouldn't do it doesn't mean that other wouldn't.

[grizzaholic]

You are officially nuts. What kind of backwards logic is that?

And what is the big fucking deal with allowing guns in parks? People will not be hunting, target shooting. They will be SELF-FUCKING-Defense.

You give people too much credit, Grizza. Have you ever looked at road signs on mountain roads? Just because you wouldn't do it doesn't mean that other wouldn't.

I have reported more than a couple of people to the authorities about shooting signs. FUCKING DOLTS.

[wkuhillhound]

Tennessee had a similar that was vetoed by the governor but was overridden by the legislature. UGH!!!
Tennessee is also trying to pass legislature to make it legal to have a weapon in national parks. Disgusting.

Personally I think it is a ignoramous idea. Violence begets violence plain and simple. Even if you are a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't feel safe with anyone carry a handgun. It is ludicrous. Law abiding citizens become criminals in an instant. It's a no-win situation.

Did I just read that correctly?

If you have to bring a gun to a bar, why are at a bar? Fair question to me. Just the presence of a gun doesn't make me any safer, period. One false move and I can be history just because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[wkuhillhound]

I guess cops, and our military are all criminals than.

When they are guilty of crimes, yes. DUH!!!!

[Appaholic]

So the clubs are serving healthy amounts and not to excess?

Each serving is a healthy amount.

I can drink, and you can sit next to me, and be unaffected. Same can't be said for cigarettes or guns

How is having a concealed gun affecting you?

[Appaholic]

That's not what you said in the past. What if he drinks a 6 pack?

Appaholic can drink all the beer in the world and not affect me, unless he on me

You just earned a hat buddy......

[Appaholic]

Did I just read that correctly?

If you have to bring a gun to a bar, why are at a bar? Fair question to me. Just the presence of a gun doesn't make me any safer, period. One false move and I can be history just because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Not the point. If we based all laws upon whether all people felt safe in all endeavors, we wouldn't be allowed to leave the house....and, in the next sentence, replace "gun" with "policeman" or "seatbelt" or "airbags" and you might start to realize how ridiculous this rationale is.......

[polsongrizz]

Bingo

Not that I buy into all this stuff about guns in bars becoming more dangerous. People have said that allowing CCP folks to carry guns on college campuses would mean shootouts all over campus but among the 11 universities that permit students with CCP there hasn't even been so much as 1 accident. We've serisouly got a bad case of irrational gunphobia in this country.

That makes absolutely no sense. How many of those students were drunk off their ass? I have a cwp and never would I carry while drinking in a bar. You are just asking for trouble, not to mention numerous lawsuits.

[Wedgebuster]

Appaholic can drink all the beer in the world and not affect me, unless he on me

You just earned a hat buddy......

Lemmie guess, a "ball" cap, right?

[grizzaholic]

You just earned a hat buddy......

Lemmie guess, a "ball" cap, right?

[Appaholic]

Bingo

Not that I buy into all this stuff about guns in bars becoming more dangerous. People have said that allowing CCP folks to carry guns on college campuses would mean shootouts all over campus but among the 11 universities that permit students with CCP there hasn't even been so much as 1 accident. We've serisouly got a bad case of irrational gunphobia in this country.

That makes absolutely no sense. How many of those students were drunk off their ass? I have a cwp and never would I carry while drinking in a bar. You are just asking for trouble, not to mention numerous lawsuits.

Exactly...but it is the choice of both patron and owner to assess that risk....carrying a gun to a bar does not result in automatic mayhem......however, carrying a drunk Appa to breakfast on the other hand.....

[houndawg]

That makes absolutely no sense. How many of those students were drunk off their ass? I have a cwp and never would I carry while drinking in a bar. You are just asking for trouble, not to mention numerous lawsuits.

Exactly...but it is the choice of both patron and owner to assess that risk....carrying a gun to a bar does not result in automatic mayhem......however, carrying a drunk Appa to breakfast on the other hand.....

If you need to pack at a bar, you're hanging at the wrong bar.

[Appaholic]

Exactly...but it is the choice of both patron and owner to assess that risk....carrying a gun to a bar does not result in automatic mayhem......however, carrying a drunk Appa to breakfast on the other hand.....

If you need to pack at a bar, you're hanging at the wrong bar.

Agree....

[CID1990]

My original post had nothing to do with whether or not we are being gun phobic or constitutional rights or anything else like that. I'm generally a proponent of concealed carry, but then I come from background having grown up with guns as a hunter, and then as a career cop- in other words I come from a culture of responsible gun use and ownership.

My problem with guns in bars is a matter of judgment. Cops in every jurisdiction I can think of are not allowed to carry their weapons into bars in an off duty capacity. The reason for this is that if you shoot someone and there is ONE DROP of alcohol in your system, then you will be held liable for the shooting if the justification or actual performance was less than perfect- and it is NEVER perfect.

Additionally, ALL concealed carry permits in every state are invalidated when alcohol is being consumed. In other words, for a state to allow concealed carry inside drinking establishments is akin to state enacting laws allowing people to sunbathe on the moon. It makes no sense. The alcoholic consumption clause in concealed carry permits exists because alcohol impairs the judgment necessary for deadly force situations.

I guess that in the strictest libertarian sense, you should be able to carry a concealed gun anywhere. I can understand the rationale. However, if I lived in a state where this was allowed I would never again patronize bars there. Period. Somebody will get killed, and it is just as likely to be an innocent bystander as a bad guy; and the bad guy might simply be someone who pissed the drunk guy with the gun off.

Again, bad idea.

[ASUG8]

My original post had nothing to do with whether or not we are being gun phobic or constitutional rights or anything else like that. I'm generally a proponent of concealed carry, but then I come from background having grown up with guns as a hunter, and then as a career cop- in other words I come from a culture of responsible gun use and ownership.

My problem with guns in bars is a matter of judgment. Cops in every jurisdiction I can think of are not allowed to carry their weapons into bars in an off duty capacity. The reason for this is that if you shoot someone and there is ONE DROP of alcohol in your system, then you will be held liable for the shooting if the justification or actual performance was less than perfect- and it is NEVER perfect.

Additionally, ALL concealed carry permits in every state are invalidated when alcohol is being consumed. In other words, for a state to allow concealed carry inside drinking establishments is akin to state enacting laws allowing people to sunbathe on the moon. It makes no sense. The alcoholic consumption clause in concealed carry permits exists because alcohol impairs the judgment necessary for deadly force situations.

I guess that in the strictest libertarian sense, you should be able to carry a concealed gun anywhere. I can understand the rationale. However, if I lived in a state where this was allowed I would never again patronize bars there. Period. Somebody will get killed, and it is just as likely to be an innocent bystander as a bad guy; and the bad guy might simply be someone who pissed the drunk guy with the gun off.

Again, bad idea.

My point from earlier, except you made it sound like you knew what the hell you were talking about.

[polsongrizz]

however, carrying a drunk Appa to breakfast on the other hand.....

Sadly it was a necessary evil, you were buying...

[Appaholic]

however, carrying a drunk Appa to breakfast on the other hand.....

Sadly it was a necessary evil, you were buying...

Correction: Company was buying....

[Pwns]

Bingo

Not that I buy into all this stuff about guns in bars becoming more dangerous. People have said that allowing CCP folks to carry guns on college campuses would mean shootouts all over campus but among the 11 universities that permit students with CCP there hasn't even been so much as 1 accident. We've serisouly got a bad case of irrational gunphobia in this country.

That makes absolutely no sense. How many of those students were drunk off their ass? I have a cwp and never would I carry while drinking in a bar. You are just asking for trouble, not to mention numerous lawsuits.

It's a college campus...there are going to be drunk students. Obviously there are no rules to keep people from packing weapons while being intoxicated, and there have been no incidents. If a person is going to a bar to eat and socialize (you know there will be a DD in each group) I see no reason why they can't bring a gun in if the owner permits it.