PA Catholic Pedo Scandal

[houndawg]

But Joe, the CHURCH DID KNOW how widespread it was, and kept it quiet. The church did not disclose to those parents - well, you only the 10th parent that has complained about Father Murphy. Don't try to place the blame back on the parents.

The Catholic Church! Our pedo problem is really not much worse than anyone elses’s!

but...but...what about Hillary?

[Ibanez]

Meanwhile, in SC, the Catholic Church is experiencing a boom in new members and new parishes while Protestant churches are losing members and closing up shop.


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Any idea why that is? Do you have a lot of C and S Americans moving there?

Not sure what C and S Americans are but the growing Hispanic population is certainly one of the many reasons.


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[houndawg]

what "other organizations" are you referring to, Joe?

Well, let's start with mainline Protestant denominations. Historically, church councils quietly cut loose an abusive pastor. A few months later, he 'd get hired by another church a few hundred miles away. Heck, Billy Graham's grandson recently said, after performing a study, that he believed that the system of sexual abuse cover-up was even more pervasive in Protestant denominations than in the Catholic Church. Parents were encouraged to stay silent in order to avoid scandal that would damage the church. Sound familiar? Then you can throw Jewish sects and the Jehovah's Witnesses on top of that.

I saw a report recently that in one year in New York city schools, there were 225 reports of sexual abuse, and not one of them was reported to law enforcement.

Look, the historical norm for everyone -- families, school districts, religious schools and churches -- has been cover-up. If you place any organization under the same degree of scrutiny, you could write the same report.

Anyone who claims otherwise is just full of ****.

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn this is true - Pentecostals back in the woods..hiding and breeding..

[houndawg]

Any idea why that is? Do you have a lot of C and S Americans moving there?

Not sure what C and S Americans are but the growing Hispanic population is certainly one of the many reasons.


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Central and South?

My daughter teaches ESL in Charlotte and has a pretty large class. Says they're quite well-behaved - when they get obstreperous she just asks if she needs to call their mom and its like flipping a switch.

[SeattleGriz]

Not sure what C and S Americans are but the growing Hispanic population is certainly one of the many reasons.


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Central and South?

My daughter teaches ESL in Charlotte and has a pretty large class. Says they're quite well-behaved - when they get obstreperous she just asks if she needs to call their mom and its like flipping a switch.

Yes. Been talk for years how the South and Central American populations are going to shift the Catholic church.

[clenz]

1000 children over 70 years by 300 priests. Horrible, of course. Anyone, still alive, should be thrown into jail until they die. That's 14 a year, in a state that has 11-13M people?
I'm not minimizing this report, its very disturbing. They all should be sent away until they die..

Minimize your numbers by "14 a year" all you fucking want. That's more than one a month. Total population is irrelevant.

You need to narrow it down to the number of kids between ages of say 5-14 in catholic churches. The rest of the population doesn't matter.

According to https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/us- ... olics.html 24% of PA is Catholic. That means that number goes from 11,000,000 to 2.75m. Now, we need to cut out everyone outside of about a 8-10 year age range of 5-14. You're down to a very, very, small portion of the population. Within that small population size more than 1 a month has come forward and been found to be molested by a priest.

You can keep saying you aren't trying to minimize but, but by throwing out statements like "only 14 per year in a state of 11,000,000" is doing that.

Chances are you can triple that number, easily, and you might almost come close to the real number.

[SeattleGriz]

1000 children over 70 years by 300 priests. Horrible, of course. Anyone, still alive, should be thrown into jail until they die. That's 14 a year, in a state that has 11-13M people?
I'm not minimizing this report, its very disturbing. They all should be sent away until they die..

Minimize your numbers by "14 a year" all you fucking want. That's more than one a month. Total population is irrelevant.

You need to narrow it down to the number of kids between ages of say 5-14 in catholic churches. The rest of the population doesn't matter.

According to https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/us- ... olics.html 24% of PA is Catholic. That means that number goes from 11,000,000 to 2.75m. Now, we need to cut out everyone outside of about a 8-10 year age range of 5-14. You're down to a very, very, small portion of the population. Within that small population size more than 1 a month has come forward and been found to be molested by a priest.

You can keep saying you aren't trying to minimize but, but by throwing out statements like "only 14 per year in a state of 11,000,000" is doing that.

Chances are you can triple that number, easily, and you might almost come close to the real number.

What a minute. Did you just correct him on number facts and then say, "chances are" in your talley?

[JoltinJoe]

Well, let's start with mainline Protestant denominations. Historically, church councils quietly cut loose an abusive pastor. A few months later, he 'd get hired by another church a few hundred miles away. Heck, Billy Graham's grandson recently said, after performing a study, that he believed that the system of sexual abuse cover-up was even more pervasive in Protestant denominations than in the Catholic Church. Parents were encouraged to stay silent in order to avoid scandal that would damage the church. Sound familiar? Then you can throw Jewish sects and the Jehovah's Witnesses on top of that.

I saw a report recently that in one year in New York city schools, there were 225 reports of sexual abuse, and not one of them was reported to law enforcement.

Look, the historical norm for everyone -- families, school districts, religious schools and churches -- has been cover-up. If you place any organization under the same degree of scrutiny, you could write the same report.

Anyone who claims otherwise is just full of ****.

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn this is true - Pentecostals back in the woods..hiding and breeding..

It is true, but you won't hear about in the media, because they have become lazy and only report what is spoon fed to them by personal injury lawyers about these matters.

We've heard a lot about the Catholic Church, because it has a centralized target -- the diocese -- against which personal injury lawyers can join every claim for abuse within hundreds of miles. Because of the way it is structured, the Catholic Church is an inviting litigation target for the lawyers, who can make tons of money for joining together 150 claims (while really only actively prosecuting three or four of their best ("representative") cases at a time.

These lawyers then provide information about these three or four cases for the press to print (without needing to perform its own investigation). The press reports on these three or four claims and create the impression that these claims are representative of the 145 other claims in the lawsuit.

In order to prosecute sex abuse claims against a Protestant church, you have to sue each church individually on perhaps two or three claims at a time. Yuck! Real lawyer work for a far smaller return. And since the lawyers aren't taking these cases, they aren't handing out information to the press about the Protestant abuse cover-up. And the press, as I said, is too lazy to actually perform an independent investigation.

[JoltinJoe]

1000 children over 70 years by 300 priests. Horrible, of course. Anyone, still alive, should be thrown into jail until they die. That's 14 a year, in a state that has 11-13M people?
I'm not minimizing this report, its very disturbing. They all should be sent away until they die..

Minimize your numbers by "14 a year" all you **** want. That's more than one a month. Total population is irrelevant.

You need to narrow it down to the number of kids between ages of say 5-14 in catholic churches. The rest of the population doesn't matter.

According to https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/us- ... olics.html 24% of PA is Catholic. That means that number goes from 11,000,000 to 2.75m. Now, we need to cut out everyone outside of about a 8-10 year age range of 5-14. You're down to a very, very, small portion of the population. Within that small population size more than 1 a month has come forward and been found to be molested by a priest.

You can keep saying you aren't trying to minimize but, but by throwing out statements like "only 14 per year in a state of 11,000,000" is doing that.

Chances are you can triple that number, easily, and you might almost come close to the real number.

The numbers have already been largely examined by a number of studies that conclude that children in Catholic schools were actually safer than children in public schools.

[93henfan]

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn this is true - Pentecostals back in the woods..hiding and breeding..

It is true, but you won't hear about in the media, because they have become lazy and only report what is spoon fed to them by personal injury lawyers about these matters.

We've heard a lot about the Catholic Church, because it has a centralized target -- the diocese -- against which personal injury lawyers can join every claim for abuse within hundreds of miles. Because of the way it is structured, the Catholic Church is an inviting litigation target for the lawyers, who can make tons of money for joining together 150 claims (while really only actively prosecuting three or four of their best ("representative") cases at a time.

These lawyers then provide information about these three or four cases for the press to print (without needing to perform its own investigation). The press reports on these three or four claims and create the impression that these claims are representative of the 145 other claims in the lawsuit.

In order to prosecute sex abuse claims against a Protestant church, you have to sue each church individually on perhaps two or three claims at a time. Yuck! Real lawyer work for a far smaller return. And since the lawyers aren't taking these cases, they aren't handing out information to the press about the Protestant abuse cover-up. And the press, as I said, is too lazy to actually perform an independent investigation.

A lot of truth in that post.

I still don’t feel sorry that one violator is easier to prosecute than the rest though.

[JoltinJoe]

It is true, but you won't hear about in the media, because they have become lazy and only report what is spoon fed to them by personal injury lawyers about these matters.

We've heard a lot about the Catholic Church, because it has a centralized target -- the diocese -- against which personal injury lawyers can join every claim for abuse within hundreds of miles. Because of the way it is structured, the Catholic Church is an inviting litigation target for the lawyers, who can make tons of money for joining together 150 claims (while really only actively prosecuting three or four of their best ("representative") cases at a time.

These lawyers then provide information about these three or four cases for the press to print (without needing to perform its own investigation). The press reports on these three or four claims and create the impression that these claims are representative of the 145 other claims in the lawsuit.

In order to prosecute sex abuse claims against a Protestant church, you have to sue each church individually on perhaps two or three claims at a time. Yuck! Real lawyer work for a far smaller return. And since the lawyers aren't taking these cases, they aren't handing out information to the press about the Protestant abuse cover-up. And the press, as I said, is too lazy to actually perform an independent investigation.

A lot of truth in that post.

I still don’t feel sorry that one violator is easier to prosecute than the rest though.

I agree 100%.

My point is discussing in this isn't to excuse or down play criminal acts by heinous people.

it is to send the message that, until we really address the reality of sex abuse and the cover-up of sex abuse, which is pervasive in every organization that has significant youth outreaches, kids remain at high risk.

[Chizzang]

I agree 100%.

My point is discussing in this isn't to excuse or down play criminal acts by heinous people.

it is to send the message that, until we really address the reality of sex abuse and the cover-up of sex abuse, which is pervasive in every organization that has significant youth outreaches, kids remain at high risk.

Oh please... (insert eye roll here)
Joe your intention is to make sure everybody understands that the Catholic Church isn't the boogie man
By any means possible

You've been defending the Catholic Church on here for more than a decade
So lets not entirely excuse ourselves from our tendencies

Even if everything you said was a pinpoint fact - it was still said in the defense of your beloved
Not in the hopes of bringing light to a world of abuse



Just own it Joe...
It's okay

You sound like a defense lawyer

[HI54UNI]

Minimize your numbers by "14 a year" all you **** want. That's more than one a month. Total population is irrelevant.

You need to narrow it down to the number of kids between ages of say 5-14 in catholic churches. The rest of the population doesn't matter.

According to https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/us- ... olics.html 24% of PA is Catholic. That means that number goes from 11,000,000 to 2.75m. Now, we need to cut out everyone outside of about a 8-10 year age range of 5-14. You're down to a very, very, small portion of the population. Within that small population size more than 1 a month has come forward and been found to be molested by a priest.

You can keep saying you aren't trying to minimize but, but by throwing out statements like "only 14 per year in a state of 11,000,000" is doing that.

Chances are you can triple that number, easily, and you might almost come close to the real number.

The numbers have already been largely examined by a number of studies that conclude that children in Catholic schools were actually safer than children in public schools.

We only molested one kid, they molested two (maybe)! Why are you picking on us?

[JoltinJoe]

I agree 100%.

My point is discussing in this isn't to excuse or down play criminal acts by heinous people.

it is to send the message that, until we really address the reality of sex abuse and the cover-up of sex abuse, which is pervasive in every organization that has significant youth outreaches, kids remain at high risk.

Oh please... (insert eye roll here)
Joe your intention is to make sure everybody understands that the Catholic Church isn't the boogie man
By any means possible

You've been defending the Catholic Church on here for more than a decade
So lets not entirely excuse ourselves from our tendencies

Even if everything you said was a pinpoint fact - it was still said in the defense of your beloved
Not in the hopes of bringing light to a world of abuse



Just own it Joe...
It's okay

You sound like a defense lawyer

Why don't you own that you're an arrogant tool?

[JoltinJoe]

The numbers have already been largely examined by a number of studies that conclude that children in Catholic schools were actually safer than children in public schools.

We only molested one kid, they molested two (maybe)! Why are you picking on us?

Classic deflection of the anti-Catholics.

Why do you complain that we call her "Bloody Mary" for executing eight Protestants, when Henry VIII executed THOUSANDS of Catholics, but he has only gone down in history as a bad guy because he beheaded two of his wives?

[Ibanez]

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn this is true - Pentecostals back in the woods..hiding and breeding..

It is true, but you won't hear about in the media, because they have become lazy and only report what is spoon fed to them by personal injury lawyers about these matters.

We've heard a lot about the Catholic Church, because it has a centralized target -- the diocese -- against which personal injury lawyers can join every claim for abuse within hundreds of miles. Because of the way it is structured, the Catholic Church is an inviting litigation target for the lawyers, who can make tons of money for joining together 150 claims (while really only actively prosecuting three or four of their best ("representative") cases at a time.

These lawyers then provide information about these three or four cases for the press to print (without needing to perform its own investigation). The press reports on these three or four claims and create the impression that these claims are representative of the 145 other claims in the lawsuit.

In order to prosecute sex abuse claims against a Protestant church, you have to sue each church individually on perhaps two or three claims at a time. Yuck! Real lawyer work for a far smaller return. And since the lawyers aren't taking these cases, they aren't handing out information to the press about the Protestant abuse cover-up. And the press, as I said, is too lazy to actually perform an independent investigation.

Executive summary - Lawyers go for the low hanging fruit.

[Chizzang]

Oh please... (insert eye roll here)
Joe your intention is to make sure everybody understands that the Catholic Church isn't the boogie man
By any means possible

You've been defending the Catholic Church on here for more than a decade
So lets not entirely excuse ourselves from our tendencies

Even if everything you said was a pinpoint fact - it was still said in the defense of your beloved
Not in the hopes of bringing light to a world of abuse



Just own it Joe...
It's okay

You sound like a defense lawyer

Why don't you own that you're an arrogant tool?

I'm working on it... give me another decade

[HI54UNI]

We only molested one kid, they molested two (maybe)! Why are you picking on us?

Classic deflection of the anti-Catholics.

Why do you complain that we call her "Bloody Mary" for executing eight Protestants, when Henry VIII executed THOUSANDS of Catholics, but he has only gone down in history as a bad guy because he beheaded two of his wives?

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this shit up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

[Ibanez]

Classic deflection of the anti-Catholics.

Why do you complain that we call her "Bloody Mary" for executing eight Protestants, when Henry VIII executed THOUSANDS of Catholics, but he has only gone down in history as a bad guy because he beheaded two of his wives?

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this shit up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

PAPIST!

[JoltinJoe]

Classic deflection of the anti-Catholics.

Why do you complain that we call her "Bloody Mary" for executing eight Protestants, when Henry VIII executed THOUSANDS of Catholics, but he has only gone down in history as a bad guy because he beheaded two of his wives?

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this **** up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

It's funny that you would call anyone's argument weak and anyone else "foolish." This is an off-point, non-sensical screed. The best I can make out is that it's ok for you to ignore sexual abuse in all other contexts because you use to be Catholic.

[clenz]

Classic deflection of the anti-Catholics.

Why do you complain that we call her "Bloody Mary" for executing eight Protestants, when Henry VIII executed THOUSANDS of Catholics, but he has only gone down in history as a bad guy because he beheaded two of his wives?

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this shit up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

NW Iowa Dutch being douchey assholes, racist, bigoted fuck bags? Fucking never. NW Iowa is NEVER like that...ever. It's totally not stuck in the 1860s-1880s when almost all of the came over.

I've been disowned by my entire family - outside of my parents - the church I grew up in, and basically my entire town because I dared leave the area, not return, and left all religion because they drove me out with how they acted. Seriously, I haven't been back to my hometown in over 5 years, won't got back until my parents need to be buried, haven't talked to anyone in the church I went to my entire life since I left the area. NW Iowa is a fucking cesspool. I've been out of the area for 12 years and am still learning just how fucked up it was. The area I'm in now has a bunch of Catholics. I knew as many Catholics growing up as I did non-white people. That total is 1. The story of being called fish eater, and any of the anti-catholic things you think you'd hear, are extremely telling of the area. Anyone who grew up Catholic in NW Iowa, even if they left the faith for whatever reason, almost assuredly can't be called anti-Catholic in the way it was used here.


My father grew up Catholic in Minnesota. He won't talk about it. He's not a sharing person to begin with, but the way he does everything he can not to speak of his time in Catholic school or any time in the church is pretty telling.



The point of my post was to show that no matter how hard Catholics (not all, I grant) condemn these cases they are almost (Again not all I grant) met with some qualifying "Well it was only this many per year" or "It wasn't all of them" or anything else like that. This isn't exclusive to Catholics and this situation. It's any group that uses it's power to control kids like this.

Charles Manson never actually killed anyone. Why should he be treated the way he was/is?

Larry Nasser worked with tens of thousands of girls over his career. Only 332 have come forward with accusations. He started training in 1986. Between his first day and his last day was 30 years. Michigan State covered it up - much like the Catholic Church and their priests. 332 girls over 30 years is less than one a month - LESS THAN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ISSUE. Clearly what he did was an issue, but man it's not fair to look at the wrong doings of USA Gymnastics, Michigan State, or anything else. As long as they say "We don't like what he did and condemn it" they are doing enough, right?

The defending of the Catholic priest situation is similar to that of the way PSU fans defended Jo P. They way OSU fans are defending Urban Meyer. Michigan State and the Nasser situation. Cultism is a hell of a drug when it comes to finding ways to defend the indefensible. Making it a "us vs them" mentality. Blaming the victims.

[∞∞∞]

Clenz

[HI54UNI]

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this **** up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

Don't get mad at us because we molested some kids when everybody else is doing it too.

FIFY

[JoltinJoe]

I was wondering how long it would be before you called me anti-Catholic to deflect from your weak arguments because you do it almost every time. It's like people that scream "racism". What the hell does Bloody Mary or Henry VIII have to do with priests molesting kids? I've never mentioned either. You're the one deflecting.

Just because I don't drink the Kool-aid doesn't make me anti-Catholic.

I was born and raised RC. I grew up in a small town with a small Catholic parish that only had about 8 boys in my age range so I've probably served as an altar boy at as many or more masses than anyone on this board (and no I was never molested by any priests!). I was a lector in HS too. My wife and I were married in a Catholic Church by my FIL's priest cousin. My parents are active Catholics. My dad has two sisters that became nuns. One became mother superior of her order - the Franciscans in Rochester. Maybe you've heard of them - they founded St. Mary's hospital and convinced Dr. Mayo into serving at the hospital. I've been called fish eater and seen the bias against Catholics first hand - people wouldn't do business with my dad because we were Catholic (ask Clenz - he knows what the Dutch in NW Iowa are like). Is this enough to convince you I'm not anti-Catholic?

Quit trying to defend this by making the "they did it too and more than we did" argument. It doesn't work and it makes you look foolish. The Church has been covering this **** up for years. Accusations would happen and they would move the priest to another parish where he could start all over. People need to be held accountable. I agree that there are shyster trial lawyers involved and the press are lazy. But that's another issue. Let's start by cleaning up what we do know and then we can move on to the next perpetrator and go after them.

NW Iowa Dutch being douchey assholes, racist, bigoted **** bags? **** never. NW Iowa is NEVER like that...ever. It's totally not stuck in the 1860s-1880s when almost all of the came over.

I've been disowned by my entire family - outside of my parents - the church I grew up in, and basically my entire town because I dared leave the area, not return, and left all religion because they drove me out with how they acted. Seriously, I haven't been back to my hometown in over 5 years, won't got back until my parents need to be buried, haven't talked to anyone in the church I went to my entire life since I left the area. NW Iowa is a **** cesspool. I've been out of the area for 12 years and am still learning just how **** up it was. The area I'm in now has a bunch of Catholics. I knew as many Catholics growing up as I did non-white people. That total is 1. The story of being called fish eater, and any of the anti-catholic things you think you'd hear, are extremely telling of the area. Anyone who grew up Catholic in NW Iowa, even if they left the faith for whatever reason, almost assuredly can't be called anti-Catholic in the way it was used here.


My father grew up Catholic in Minnesota. He won't talk about it. He's not a sharing person to begin with, but the way he does everything he can not to speak of his time in Catholic school or any time in the church is pretty telling.



The point of my post was to show that no matter how hard Catholics (not all, I grant) condemn these cases they are almost (Again not all I grant) met with some qualifying "Well it was only this many per year" or "It wasn't all of them" or anything else like that. This isn't exclusive to Catholics and this situation. It's any group that uses it's power to control kids like this.

Charles Manson never actually killed anyone. Why should he be treated the way he was/is?

Larry Nasser worked with tens of thousands of girls over his career. Only 332 have come forward with accusations. He started training in 1986. Between his first day and his last day was 30 years. Michigan State covered it up - much like the Catholic Church and their priests. 332 girls over 30 years is less than one a month - LESS THAN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ISSUE. Clearly what he did was an issue, but man it's not fair to look at the wrong doings of USA Gymnastics, Michigan State, or anything else. As long as they say "We don't like what he did and condemn it" they are doing enough, right?

The defending of the Catholic priest situation is similar to that of the way PSU fans defended Jo P. They way OSU fans are defending Urban Meyer. Michigan State and the Nasser situation. Cultism is a hell of a drug when it comes to finding ways to defend the indefensible. Making it a "us vs them" mentality. Blaming the victims.

Another pointless ramble.

Seriously, perhaps you and HI54UNI need to lie down on a couch and pay someone to work these things through with you.

[houndawg]

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn this is true - Pentecostals back in the woods..hiding and breeding..

It is true, but you won't hear about in the media, because they have become lazy and only report what is spoon fed to them by personal injury lawyers about these matters.

We've heard a lot about the Catholic Church, because it has a centralized target -- the diocese -- against which personal injury lawyers can join every claim for abuse within hundreds of miles. Because of the way it is structured, the Catholic Church is an inviting litigation target for the lawyers, who can make tons of money for joining together 150 claims (while really only actively prosecuting three or four of their best ("representative") cases at a time.

These lawyers then provide information about these three or four cases for the press to print (without needing to perform its own investigation). The press reports on these three or four claims and create the impression that these claims are representative of the 145 other claims in the lawsuit.

In order to prosecute sex abuse claims against a Protestant church, you have to sue each church individually on perhaps two or three claims at a time. Yuck! Real lawyer work for a far smaller return. And since the lawyers aren't taking these cases, they aren't handing out information to the press about the Protestant abuse cover-up. And the press, as I said, is too lazy to actually perform an independent investigation.

Sue the church camps. Lots of kids from different churches of the same denomination