....and I'm saying I agree with you. And that being the case, we're wasting our money funding/stocking/arming a military we refuse to use. Let's spend it on universal healthcare.Cleets Part 2 wrote:Dude.. I'm not saying I like it - I'm just pointing out the truth (as I see it) in regards to congress and WarAZGrizFan wrote:
Then we should disband the military and save the money.
AZGrizFan wrote:....and I'm saying I agree with you. And that being the case, we're wasting our money funding/stocking/arming a military we refuse to use. Let's spend it on universal healthcare.Cleets Part 2 wrote:
Dude.. I'm not saying I like it - I'm just pointing out the truth (as I see it) in regards to congress and War
But Dude...AZGrizFan wrote:....and I'm saying I agree with you. And that being the case, we're wasting our money funding/stocking/arming a military we refuse to use. Let's spend it on universal healthcare.Cleets Part 2 wrote:
Dude.. I'm not saying I like it - I'm just pointing out the truth (as I see it) in regards to congress and War
No shit..?travelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
Humans are and will always be part of the animal kingdom, fighting for control of food, water, territory and survival (sex). Every male knows this, and those that deny it are either lying or an idiot. Wars will continue forever, yet how we philosophically plan for and execute those wars will determine the scope of the atrocities: Quick, "surgical", "overwhelming" execution will provide the means to ultimately minimize the extent of damage to combatants, civilians, and infrastructures. Politicization (diplomatic micromanagement) of war ALWAYS ultimately results in an increase in casualties and damage. Adoption of pacifistic governance and defense policies assures cultural/regional genocide.
Once non-democratic nations understand the futility (finite existence) of their structure, the resulting fear of their hegemonic mortality creates an irrational compulsion to destroy all that would challenge the status quo. That compulsion, left unchallenged by democratic nations, generally results in the incomprehensible (and frequent) democide and genocide.
(If you have the stomach, R.J. Rummel of U.of VA has compiled an eye-opening resource of genocide, democide and policide occurring since since 1900. Save the pics page for dinner time reading.
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE5.HTM )
The "indecision-as-policy" practices of the U.N., as well as that practiced by the "Progressive" liberal snake-oil salespeople, have been the CHIEF cause of most genocide over the past century. The lame unsubstantiated rationalization peddled by the genocide facilitators, that 18th/19th century western imperialism would fluorish as a result of unimpeded democratic nation military intervention, can quickly be dispelled by reviewing western abandonment of "established" military/government and transportation facilities in foreign nations, as well as mitigating potential economic subjugation fears with the establishment of the multi-national managed World Bank and other U.N. managed global aid funds, over the past half century.
In retrospect, Cronkite's limousine liberal thoughtlessness, as is with most liberals who deny humanity's essence, unquestionably encouraged the S.E. Asian communists to escalate their efforts during the TET offensive. Don't forget, the "TET Offensive" was a series of three separate offensives that lasted from January until late September in 1968...Cronkite's "pronouncement" that America had been defeated occurred on February 27, 1968... BEFORE the concerted VC attacks in May and August. The first offensive wave during the first two weeks of February left around 45,000 VC dead, but less than 4,000 U.S., allied and S. Vietnamese soldiers had been killed: A 10 to 1 kill ratio, and one which had depleted the NVA's forces to a degree that they withdrew from captured territories during March and April until their troop strength could be replenished. In no uncertain terms, the U.S. had knocked the shit out of the NVA despite their spending almost a year to plan the offensive, and deployment of large stockpiles of brand new weaponry [AK-47's, RPG's]. Simultaneously, the NVA had entered into a truce negotiation as a ploy to interrupt U.S. bombing campaigns, which resumed, of course, after the initial offensive wave.
The NVA had asked to return to the negotiation table AFTER getting their dicks stuffed in the dirt during the initial offensive...yet, despite being devastatingly dominated by U.S. bombing and their dismal failed offensive, THE NVA FOUGHT ON, AND EVEN CONTINUED THE TET OFFENSIVE MOUNTING TWO MORE WAVE OFFENSIVES IN 1968, just coincidentally after the Cronkite pronouncement, which, most believe, influenced Johnson's decision/announcement NOT to run for re-election, yet another action which fed the NVA's compulsion to fight on, and even escalate the scale of their offensives.
Indeed, the a great volume of the bloodshed and lost lives UNQUESTIONABLY resulted from Cronkite's thoughtless, ill-informed, anti-American, cowardly adjudication.
I've said it many times: Whether it's called "karma", "accountability", "judgement" or simply "a reckoning"...sooner or later we're all held to account for our sins. Cronkite's day of judgement arrived, and I have no doubt he will be held to account for his irresponsible conduct.
You know, I tried to read all that, and as I read along I kept waiting for you to get to the part about fluoridation of water, Communist conspiracies and the sanctity of our precious bodily fluidstravelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
Humans are and will always be part of the animal kingdom, fighting for control of food, water, territory and survival (sex). Every male knows this, and those that deny it are either lying or an idiot. Wars will continue forever, yet how we philosophically plan for and execute those wars will determine the scope of the atrocities: Quick, "surgical", "overwhelming" execution will provide the means to ultimately minimize the extent of damage to combatants, civilians, and infrastructures. Politicization (diplomatic micromanagement) of war ALWAYS ultimately results in an increase in casualties and damage. Adoption of pacifistic governance and defense policies assures cultural/regional genocide.
Once non-democratic nations understand the futility (finite existence) of their structure, the resulting fear of their hegemonic mortality creates an irrational compulsion to destroy all that would challenge the status quo. That compulsion, left unchallenged by democratic nations, generally results in the incomprehensible (and frequent) democide and genocide.
(If you have the stomach, R.J. Rummel of U.of VA has compiled an eye-opening resource of genocide, democide and policide occurring since since 1900. Save the pics page for dinner time reading.
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE5.HTM )
The "indecision-as-policy" practices of the U.N., as well as that practiced by the "Progressive" liberal snake-oil salespeople, have been the CHIEF cause of most genocide over the past century. The lame unsubstantiated rationalization peddled by the genocide facilitators, that 18th/19th century western imperialism would fluorish as a result of unimpeded democratic nation military intervention, can quickly be dispelled by reviewing western abandonment of "established" military/government and transportation facilities in foreign nations, as well as mitigating potential economic subjugation fears with the establishment of the multi-national managed World Bank and other U.N. managed global aid funds, over the past half century.
In retrospect, Cronkite's limousine liberal thoughtlessness, as is with most liberals who deny humanity's essence, unquestionably encouraged the S.E. Asian communists to escalate their efforts during the TET offensive. Don't forget, the "TET Offensive" was a series of three separate offensives that lasted from January until late September in 1968...Cronkite's "pronouncement" that America had been defeated occurred on February 27, 1968... BEFORE the concerted VC attacks in May and August. The first offensive wave during the first two weeks of February left around 45,000 VC dead, but less than 4,000 U.S., allied and S. Vietnamese soldiers had been killed: A 10 to 1 kill ratio, and one which had depleted the NVA's forces to a degree that they withdrew from captured territories during March and April until their troop strength could be replenished. In no uncertain terms, the U.S. had knocked the shit out of the NVA despite their spending almost a year to plan the offensive, and deployment of large stockpiles of brand new weaponry [AK-47's, RPG's]. Simultaneously, the NVA had entered into a truce negotiation as a ploy to interrupt U.S. bombing campaigns, which resumed, of course, after the initial offensive wave.
The NVA had asked to return to the negotiation table AFTER getting their dicks stuffed in the dirt during the initial offensive...yet, despite being devastatingly dominated by U.S. bombing and their dismal failed offensive, THE NVA FOUGHT ON, AND EVEN CONTINUED THE TET OFFENSIVE MOUNTING TWO MORE WAVE OFFENSIVES IN 1968, just coincidentally after the Cronkite pronouncement, which, most believe, influenced Johnson's decision/announcement NOT to run for re-election, yet another action which fed the NVA's compulsion to fight on, and even escalate the scale of their offensives.
Indeed, the a great volume of the bloodshed and lost lives UNQUESTIONABLY resulted from Cronkite's thoughtless, ill-informed, anti-American, cowardly adjudication.
I've said it many times: Whether it's called "karma", "accountability", "judgement" or simply "a reckoning"...sooner or later we're all held to account for our sins. Cronkite's day of judgement arrived, and I have no doubt he will be held to account for his irresponsible conduct.
Sorry I couldn't wrap it up in 30 minutes with a happy ending and no loose strings.bench wrote:You know, I tried to read all that, and as I read along I kept waiting for you to get to the part about fluoridation of water, Communist conspiracies and the sanctity of our precious bodily fluidstravelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
Humans are and will always be part of the animal kingdom, fighting for control of food, water, territory and survival (sex). Every male knows this, and those that deny it are either lying or an idiot. Wars will continue forever, yet how we philosophically plan for and execute those wars will determine the scope of the atrocities: Quick, "surgical", "overwhelming" execution will provide the means to ultimately minimize the extent of damage to combatants, civilians, and infrastructures. Politicization (diplomatic micromanagement) of war ALWAYS ultimately results in an increase in casualties and damage. Adoption of pacifistic governance and defense policies assures cultural/regional genocide.
Once non-democratic nations understand the futility (finite existence) of their structure, the resulting fear of their hegemonic mortality creates an irrational compulsion to destroy all that would challenge the status quo. That compulsion, left unchallenged by democratic nations, generally results in the incomprehensible (and frequent) democide and genocide.
(If you have the stomach, R.J. Rummel of U.of VA has compiled an eye-opening resource of genocide, democide and policide occurring since since 1900. Save the pics page for dinner time reading.
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE5.HTM )
The "indecision-as-policy" practices of the U.N., as well as that practiced by the "Progressive" liberal snake-oil salespeople, have been the CHIEF cause of most genocide over the past century. The lame unsubstantiated rationalization peddled by the genocide facilitators, that 18th/19th century western imperialism would fluorish as a result of unimpeded democratic nation military intervention, can quickly be dispelled by reviewing western abandonment of "established" military/government and transportation facilities in foreign nations, as well as mitigating potential economic subjugation fears with the establishment of the multi-national managed World Bank and other U.N. managed global aid funds, over the past half century.
In retrospect, Cronkite's limousine liberal thoughtlessness, as is with most liberals who deny humanity's essence, unquestionably encouraged the S.E. Asian communists to escalate their efforts during the TET offensive. Don't forget, the "TET Offensive" was a series of three separate offensives that lasted from January until late September in 1968...Cronkite's "pronouncement" that America had been defeated occurred on February 27, 1968... BEFORE the concerted VC attacks in May and August. The first offensive wave during the first two weeks of February left around 45,000 VC dead, but less than 4,000 U.S., allied and S. Vietnamese soldiers had been killed: A 10 to 1 kill ratio, and one which had depleted the NVA's forces to a degree that they withdrew from captured territories during March and April until their troop strength could be replenished. In no uncertain terms, the U.S. had knocked the shit out of the NVA despite their spending almost a year to plan the offensive, and deployment of large stockpiles of brand new weaponry [AK-47's, RPG's]. Simultaneously, the NVA had entered into a truce negotiation as a ploy to interrupt U.S. bombing campaigns, which resumed, of course, after the initial offensive wave.
The NVA had asked to return to the negotiation table AFTER getting their dicks stuffed in the dirt during the initial offensive...yet, despite being devastatingly dominated by U.S. bombing and their dismal failed offensive, THE NVA FOUGHT ON, AND EVEN CONTINUED THE TET OFFENSIVE MOUNTING TWO MORE WAVE OFFENSIVES IN 1968, just coincidentally after the Cronkite pronouncement, which, most believe, influenced Johnson's decision/announcement NOT to run for re-election, yet another action which fed the NVA's compulsion to fight on, and even escalate the scale of their offensives.
Indeed, the a great volume of the bloodshed and lost lives UNQUESTIONABLY resulted from Cronkite's thoughtless, ill-informed, anti-American, cowardly adjudication.
I've said it many times: Whether it's called "karma", "accountability", "judgement" or simply "a reckoning"...sooner or later we're all held to account for our sins. Cronkite's day of judgement arrived, and I have no doubt he will be held to account for his irresponsible conduct.
dude... i read the whole thing and am still wondering where they part got left out... I used to get screeds like this sent to public email account when I interned for Paul Wellstone's campaign and a few others...bench wrote:You know, I tried to read all that, and as I read along I kept waiting for you to get to the part about fluoridation of water, Communist conspiracies and the sanctity of our precious bodily fluidstravelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
Humans are and will always be part of the animal kingdom, fighting for control of food, water, territory and survival (sex). Every male knows this, and those that deny it are either lying or an idiot. Wars will continue forever, yet how we philosophically plan for and execute those wars will determine the scope of the atrocities: Quick, "surgical", "overwhelming" execution will provide the means to ultimately minimize the extent of damage to combatants, civilians, and infrastructures. Politicization (diplomatic micromanagement) of war ALWAYS ultimately results in an increase in casualties and damage. Adoption of pacifistic governance and defense policies assures cultural/regional genocide.
Once non-democratic nations understand the futility (finite existence) of their structure, the resulting fear of their hegemonic mortality creates an irrational compulsion to destroy all that would challenge the status quo. That compulsion, left unchallenged by democratic nations, generally results in the incomprehensible (and frequent) democide and genocide.
(If you have the stomach, R.J. Rummel of U.of VA has compiled an eye-opening resource of genocide, democide and policide occurring since since 1900. Save the pics page for dinner time reading.
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE5.HTM )
The "indecision-as-policy" practices of the U.N., as well as that practiced by the "Progressive" liberal snake-oil salespeople, have been the CHIEF cause of most genocide over the past century. The lame unsubstantiated rationalization peddled by the genocide facilitators, that 18th/19th century western imperialism would fluorish as a result of unimpeded democratic nation military intervention, can quickly be dispelled by reviewing western abandonment of "established" military/government and transportation facilities in foreign nations, as well as mitigating potential economic subjugation fears with the establishment of the multi-national managed World Bank and other U.N. managed global aid funds, over the past half century.
In retrospect, Cronkite's limousine liberal thoughtlessness, as is with most liberals who deny humanity's essence, unquestionably encouraged the S.E. Asian communists to escalate their efforts during the TET offensive. Don't forget, the "TET Offensive" was a series of three separate offensives that lasted from January until late September in 1968...Cronkite's "pronouncement" that America had been defeated occurred on February 27, 1968... BEFORE the concerted VC attacks in May and August. The first offensive wave during the first two weeks of February left around 45,000 VC dead, but less than 4,000 U.S., allied and S. Vietnamese soldiers had been killed: A 10 to 1 kill ratio, and one which had depleted the NVA's forces to a degree that they withdrew from captured territories during March and April until their troop strength could be replenished. In no uncertain terms, the U.S. had knocked the shit out of the NVA despite their spending almost a year to plan the offensive, and deployment of large stockpiles of brand new weaponry [AK-47's, RPG's]. Simultaneously, the NVA had entered into a truce negotiation as a ploy to interrupt U.S. bombing campaigns, which resumed, of course, after the initial offensive wave.
The NVA had asked to return to the negotiation table AFTER getting their dicks stuffed in the dirt during the initial offensive...yet, despite being devastatingly dominated by U.S. bombing and their dismal failed offensive, THE NVA FOUGHT ON, AND EVEN CONTINUED THE TET OFFENSIVE MOUNTING TWO MORE WAVE OFFENSIVES IN 1968, just coincidentally after the Cronkite pronouncement, which, most believe, influenced Johnson's decision/announcement NOT to run for re-election, yet another action which fed the NVA's compulsion to fight on, and even escalate the scale of their offensives.
Indeed, the a great volume of the bloodshed and lost lives UNQUESTIONABLY resulted from Cronkite's thoughtless, ill-informed, anti-American, cowardly adjudication.
I've said it many times: Whether it's called "karma", "accountability", "judgement" or simply "a reckoning"...sooner or later we're all held to account for our sins. Cronkite's day of judgement arrived, and I have no doubt he will be held to account for his irresponsible conduct.
If you didn't get the reference, I'm going to be pissedtravelinman67 wrote:Sorry I couldn't wrap it up in 30 minutes with a happy ending and no loose strings.bench wrote:You know, I tried to read all that, and as I read along I kept waiting for you to get to the part about fluoridation of water, Communist conspiracies and the sanctity of our precious bodily fluids
Wedgebuster wrote:But damn, ain't war movies great??
D1B wrote:Tman and Z, LMAO.
Taking a beating day is.
"Z, crack me open that bottle of Carnucci 2004 Cab please. I have a fucking headache."
CID1990 wrote:If anyone is interested I can recommend some reading. Much of it is postwar interviews with commanders from both sides. The assertion that Tet was a military victory is correct. In fact, even Giap has acknowledged that the Viet Cong ceased to be a viable fighting force after Tet. The NVA was also degraded, but not to the point that it collapsed like the VC.
Tet is a frustrating subject for a lot of military people because it illustrates the futility of military success (which Tet was) in the absence of the political will to see a conflict through to the end.
I might be interested in that reading.CID1990 wrote:If anyone is interested I can recommend some reading. Much of it is postwar interviews with commanders from both sides. The assertion that Tet was a military victory is correct. In fact, even Giap has acknowledged that the Viet Cong ceased to be a viable fighting force after Tet. The NVA was also degraded, but not to the point that it collapsed like the VC.
Tet is a frustrating subject for a lot of military people because it illustrates the futility of military success (which Tet was) in the absence of the political will to see a conflict through to the end.
Guess the guy's actually deciding to pull the trigger, push the button, swing the sword, etc are absolved from all blame?travelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
So you're contention is that pacifist liberal is more responsible for death than say, I don't know, actual ethnic cleanser? You would have made a good personal injury lawyer. Did you happen to marry one? 
bench wrote:If you didn't get the reference, I'm going to be pissedtravelinman67 wrote:
Sorry I couldn't wrap it up in 30 minutes with a happy ending and no loose strings.
It's amazing isn't it..!!!TerrorD wrote:Guess the guy's actually deciding to pull the trigger, push the button, swing the sword, etc are absolved from all blame?travelinman67 wrote:BTT
Hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths lay at the feet of irresponsible demagogues who thoughtlessly sell pacifistic liberalism as our global manifest destiny.
He's as crazy as a loon... but I love the hairy old nut-ballthe american people could have been fully behind the war in a way that we NEVER have (not even wwii had the kind of unanimity of support and feeling that would meet the standards you're setting)... wouldn't have changed the facts on the ground, just would have changed how long we flogged ourselves there and how many young men died fighting for no apparent reason in a country that didn't want what we were peddling.AZGrizFan wrote:CID1990 wrote:If anyone is interested I can recommend some reading. Much of it is postwar interviews with commanders from both sides. The assertion that Tet was a military victory is correct. In fact, even Giap has acknowledged that the Viet Cong ceased to be a viable fighting force after Tet. The NVA was also degraded, but not to the point that it collapsed like the VC.
Tet is a frustrating subject for a lot of military people because it illustrates the futility of military success (which Tet was) in the absence of the political will to see a conflict through to the end.
DING DING DING DING!!!!
We have a winner!!!
Cleets Part 2 wrote:It's amazing isn't it..!!!TerrorD wrote:
Guess the guy's actually deciding to pull the trigger, push the button, swing the sword, etc are absolved from all blame?
and it took him 1500 words to make that point - pacifist liberalism is more guilty in fact down right accountable for millions of deaths throughout history than imperialism, aggressive expansionism, historical religious intolerance, resource hoarding and carpet bombing...
Survival kit contents check. In them you'll find: one forty-five caliber automatic; two boxes of ammunition; four days' concentrated emergency rations; one drug issue containing antibiotics, morphine, vitamin pills, pep pills, sleeping pills, tranquilizer pills; one miniature combination Russian phrase book and Bible; one hundred dollars in rubles; one hundred dollars in gold; nine packs of chewing gum; one issue of prophylactics; three lipsticks; three pair of nylon stockings. Shoot, a fella' could have a pretty good weekend in Vegas with all that stuff.Cap'n Cat wrote:Just saw that movie for the first time a couple months ago. Dig Slim Pickens flyin' the B-52.
