Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

[GannonFan]

You know, I literally had no idea that Clemson was associated with John C Calhoun (the campus is built on land of his former plantation and Clemson is the name of Calhoun's son-in-law). And as the article says, this isn't even ancient stuff - the Honors College at Clemson was named after Calhoun back in 1981. As has been said before, Calhoun is basically the high priest of the Confederacy. Probably a good time to finally rid the state of things named after him. Heck, one of the only good things Andrew Jackson did was threaten to kill Calhoun. I'm almost willing to look past all the bad things Jackson did with that in mind.

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2020/0 ... -c-calhoun

[Ibanez]

You know, I literally had no idea that Clemson was associated with John C Calhoun (the campus is built on land of his former plantation and Clemson is the name of Calhoun's son-in-law). And as the article says, this isn't even ancient stuff - the Honors College at Clemson was named after Calhoun back in 1981. As has been said before, Calhoun is basically the high priest of the Confederacy. Probably a good time to finally rid the state of things named after him. Heck, one of the only good things Andrew Jackson did was threaten to kill Calhoun. I'm almost willing to look past all the bad things Jackson did with that in mind.

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2020/0 ... -c-calhoun

I just read this article...kinda in the same vein.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... es/612832/

As I have watched Confederate monuments being removed by state and local governments, and sometimes by the forceful will of the American people, the fact that 10 U.S. Army installations are named for Confederate officers has weighed on me.

These bases are, after all, federal installations, home to soldiers who swear an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. The irony of training at bases named for those who took up arms against the United States, and for the right to enslave others, is inescapable to anyone paying attention.

Calhoun is venerated. Calhoun Street in Charleston was originally Boundary Street - renamed during the Civil War. His statue will come down in the next 5 years - count on it.

There has been some progress made

The man who formed and led the now-defunct South Carolina Secessionist Party called for the end of Confederate flag demonstrations in an apology he released Sunday.

James Bessenger said he started the party in 2015, which he called a Confederate Heritage activism organization, in what he interpreted as "an unjust assault on the history and integrity of those who came before us in our city and our state."

"I eventually learned, however, that those in the Confederate Heritage Community who genuinely wish to preserve the cultural, historical, and academic value of the Confederacy are greatly and irreversibly outnumbered by those who have far less honorable motives," Bessenger wrote in the statement.

But he said the Confederate flag displays have "undeniably brought more harm to our community that good, I eventually learned, however, that those in the Confederate Heritage Community who genuinely wish to preserve the cultural, historical, and academic value of the Confederacy are greatly and irreversibly outnumbered by those who have far less honorable motives."

He called on the ending of "Flagging of the Charleston Battery" and said he wanted to personally apologize for the impact the party, which was disbanded in 2019, has had on the state.

https://www.live5news.com/2020/05/31/fo ... ng-events/

[BDKJMU]

It won’t be happening in red America.

It will happen to red America. When you make no major economic contributions and rely on handouts, it's easy for people and companies who actually produce wealth to squeeze your communities into submission. It's happened before and will happen again.

The world is always progressing along, and conservatives will be dragged along whether they want to or not. Sometimes it takes a while but understand this BDK, liberalism always fails in time. Always.

Advanced societies like to move forward, not stay where they are.

FIFY

[kalm]

It will happen to red America. When you make no major economic contributions and rely on handouts, it's easy for people and companies who actually produce wealth to squeeze your communities into submission. It's happened before and will happen again.

The world is always progressing along, and conservatives will be dragged along whether they want to or not. Sometimes it takes a while but understand this BDK, liberalism always fails in time. Always.

Advanced societies like to move forward, not stay where they are.

FIFY

This country was founded on liberalism.

[UNI88]

This country should just erase all history prior to 2019. Throw away all history books. Tear down all statues. Rename all streets, buildings, towns, parks, etc. that are named after anyone. Because guaranfuckingTEED that whoever something is named after, based on today’s standards they were either overtly racist, subliminally racist, systemically racist, posted a racist thought, tweeted an offensive statement, or did SOMETHING that ultimately is gonna be their downfall.

This country has lost its collective fucking mind.
Just start over with a clean slate.

Good Lord you are a drama queen.

We should NEVER honor the history or memory of RACIST, TRAITORS who tried to tear the country apart in the name of defending slavery.

The Confederates, by definition, were traitors, were racists, and had/have ZERO redeeming features.

Texas has turned your brain to mush

Can anyone honestly say that Robert E. Lee had ZERO redeeming features?

[GannonFan]

I just read this article...kinda in the same vein.
There has been some progress made

I was talking to my wife about the Army bases last night and it amazed me that not only are they named after Confederate generals (mostly, I don't think Rucker was ever a general), but there are quite a large number of decidedly bad Confederate generals in that grouping. Heck, some people argue that Bragg was so bad that he may have cost the war for the South (I wouldn't go that far, but he was terrible). And although Hood gets a decent depiction in "Gettysburg", he was almost equally as bad. They were likely going to lose Atlanta anyway, but Hood made sure they lost the city and a lot of men, and then marched that army to its destruction in Tennessee.

Most of these bases got their names right at the height of the "Lost Cause" movement in the 1930's. I'm good with renaming them, especially getting rid of the poor commanders.

[Skjellyfetti]

Lee was carried by Stonewall Jackson. Change my mind.

[UNI88]

FIFY

This country was founded on classical liberalism.

FYP - I identify as a liberal and resent the hijacking of the term by alt-leftists who are not truly liberal.

And on the subject of Trip's post, conservatism doesn't always lose in the end. What typically happens is that elements of both conservatism and liberalism blend together. There are swings back and forth but neither ideology wins or loses in the long run.

[kalm]

This country was founded on classical liberalism.

FYP - I identify as a liberal and resent the hijacking of the term by alt-leftists who are not truly liberal.

And on the subject of Trip's post, conservatism doesn't always lose in the end. What typically happens is that elements of both conservatism and liberalism blend together. There are swings back and forth but neither ideology wins or loses in the long run.

This country was founded on Jeffersonian conservatism.

(My goal is to annoy you as much as you annoy me... )

[BDKJMU]

I just read this article...kinda in the same vein.
There has been some progress made

I was talking to my wife about the Army bases last night and it amazed me that not only are they named after Confederate generals (mostly, I don't think Rucker was ever a general), but there are quite a large number of decidedly bad Confederate generals in that grouping. Heck, some people argue that Bragg was so bad that he may have cost the war for the South (I wouldn't go that far, but he was terrible). And although Hood gets a decent depiction in "Gettysburg", he was almost equally as bad. They were likely going to lose Atlanta anyway, but Hood made sure they lost the city and a lot of men, and then marched that army to its destruction in Tennessee.

Most of these bases got their names right at the height of the "Lost Cause" movement in the 1930's. I'm good with renaming them, especially getting rid of the poor commanders.

True on Hood vis a vi Atlanta and after. but Hood was a very effective brigade and division commander, with much success, esp prior to Gettysburg. Mid-late 1864, after being given command of the Army of Tennesssee by (one of Davis’s dumbest decisons of the war) Hood was a disaster during the Atlanta Campaign (July-Aug 1864) and the Franklin Nashville Campaign (Sept-Dec). Around 20k casualties during Atlanta, and more than that during Franklin-Nashville, often on foolish frontal assaults. At 33 yrs of age he was was over his head commanding an entire Army.

I was told growing up that I’m related to Bragg, a triple great uncle. Also was told how he was a shitty general..

[GannonFan]

I was talking to my wife about the Army bases last night and it amazed me that not only are they named after Confederate generals (mostly, I don't think Rucker was ever a general), but there are quite a large number of decidedly bad Confederate generals in that grouping. Heck, some people argue that Bragg was so bad that he may have cost the war for the South (I wouldn't go that far, but he was terrible). And although Hood gets a decent depiction in "Gettysburg", he was almost equally as bad. They were likely going to lose Atlanta anyway, but Hood made sure they lost the city and a lot of men, and then marched that army to its destruction in Tennessee.

Most of these bases got their names right at the height of the "Lost Cause" movement in the 1930's. I'm good with renaming them, especially getting rid of the poor commanders.

True on Hood vis a vi Atlanta and after. but Hood was a very effective brigade and division commander, with much success, esp prior to Gettysburg. Mid-late 1864, after being given command of the Army of Tennesssee by (one of Davis’s dumbest decisons of the war) Hood was a disaster during the Atlanta Campaign (July-Aug 1864) and the Franklin Nashville Campaign (Sept-Dec). Around 20k casualties during Atlanta, and more than that during Franklin-Nashville, often on foolish frontal assaults. At 33 yrs of age he was was over his head commanding an entire Army.

I was told growing up that I’m related to Bragg, a triple great uncle. Also was told how he was a shitty general..

At least you might overlook Hood's failings - he was literally a broken man as the war went on - lost the use of an arm and had a leg amputated. He was literally less of a man at the end of the war than when he started.

[UNI88]

FYP - I identify as a liberal and resent the hijacking of the term by alt-leftists who are not truly liberal.

And on the subject of Trip's post, conservatism doesn't always lose in the end. What typically happens is that elements of both conservatism and liberalism blend together. There are swings back and forth but neither ideology wins or loses in the long run.

This country was founded on Jeffersonian conservatism.

(My goal is to annoy you as much as you annoy me... )

You don't annoy me. I grew up with 8 brothers & sisters where debate and smack talk were a normal part of dinner conversation so I enjoy our verbal fencing. Bad ideas fail and good ideas are made stronger when they are subjected to scrutiny and debate.

[Ibanez]

Lee was carried by Stonewall Jackson. Change my mind.

ARe you suggesting that Jackson was the better General?


If so, nobody will really change your mind.

[Ibanez]

I just read this article...kinda in the same vein.
There has been some progress made

I was talking to my wife about the Army bases last night and it amazed me that not only are they named after Confederate generals (mostly, I don't think Rucker was ever a general), but there are quite a large number of decidedly bad Confederate generals in that grouping. Heck, some people argue that Bragg was so bad that he may have cost the war for the South (I wouldn't go that far, but he was terrible). And although Hood gets a decent depiction in "Gettysburg", he was almost equally as bad. They were likely going to lose Atlanta anyway, but Hood made sure they lost the city and a lot of men, and then marched that army to its destruction in Tennessee.

Most of these bases got their names right at the height of the "Lost Cause" movement in the 1930's. I'm good with renaming them, especially getting rid of the poor commanders.

Yeah, as I am. The Lost Cause movement really didn't do us any favors. I'm against whitewashing history but that's not what we're doing by renaming Ft. Hood.

Honestly, rename one of them after Longstreet. He may have been a confederate, but the guy was one of the best on either side.

Change my mind.

[Ibanez]

I was talking to my wife about the Army bases last night and it amazed me that not only are they named after Confederate generals (mostly, I don't think Rucker was ever a general), but there are quite a large number of decidedly bad Confederate generals in that grouping. Heck, some people argue that Bragg was so bad that he may have cost the war for the South (I wouldn't go that far, but he was terrible). And although Hood gets a decent depiction in "Gettysburg", he was almost equally as bad. They were likely going to lose Atlanta anyway, but Hood made sure they lost the city and a lot of men, and then marched that army to its destruction in Tennessee.

Most of these bases got their names right at the height of the "Lost Cause" movement in the 1930's. I'm good with renaming them, especially getting rid of the poor commanders.

True on Hood vis a vi Atlanta and after. but Hood was a very effective brigade and division commander, with much success, esp prior to Gettysburg. Mid-late 1864, after being given command of the Army of Tennesssee by (one of Davis’s dumbest decisons of the war) Hood was a disaster during the Atlanta Campaign (July-Aug 1864) and the Franklin Nashville Campaign (Sept-Dec). Around 20k casualties during Atlanta, and more than that during Franklin-Nashville, often on foolish frontal assaults. At 33 yrs of age he was was over his head commanding an entire Army.

I was told growing up that I’m related to Bragg, a triple great uncle. Also was told how he was a shitty general..

Bragg was shitty.
Hood was very good in the early years. My friend, David Hood, is the great great grandson of John Bell Hood. The family has been trying to rehab his reputation for decades. I'm not sure it's been successful.

[Skjellyfetti]

[AZGrizFan]

This country was founded on Jeffersonian conservatism.

(My goal is to annoy you as much as you annoy me... )

You don't annoy me. I grew up with 8 brothers & sisters where debate and smack talk were a normal part of dinner conversation so I enjoy our verbal fencing. Bad ideas fail and good ideas are made stronger when they are subjected to scrutiny and debate.

Biggest mistake this country ever made: “Don’t talk about religion or politics in polite company”....now, NOBODY knows how to talk about those things politely.

[Winterborn]

You don't annoy me. I grew up with 8 brothers & sisters where debate and smack talk were a normal part of dinner conversation so I enjoy our verbal fencing. Bad ideas fail and good ideas are made stronger when they are subjected to scrutiny and debate.

Biggest mistake this country ever made: “Don’t talk about religion or politics in polite company”....now, NOBODY knows how to talk about those things politely.

I think the dumbing down of education and the participation ribbon culture have more to do with it than just not talking about it.

[SeattleGriz]

This is going to be fun to watch unfold.

[kalm]

This is going to be fun to watch unfold.

I know when I think Capital Hill, the first thing that comes To mind is heavily armed and dangerous militants!

[CID1990]

This is going to be fun to watch unfold.

Heh heh




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SeattleGriz]

This is going to be fun to watch unfold.

I know when I think Capital Hill, the first thing that comes To mind is heavily armed and dangerous militants!

Before my current employer, my work building was right on the border of Capital Hill. Got sexually assaulted by a gay guy in Capital Hill.

[Skjellyfetti]

Your employer probably let you go for always misspelling Capitol Hill

[SeattleGriz]

Your employer probably let you go for always misspelling Capitol Hill

They did! I got shitfaced over it in Capital Hill.

[GannonFan]

How much of this is locally controlled? I know in PA it's almost township by township - some are really good at elections, they have plenty of polling places, they're well staffed, and things run well. In some townships, though, and still predominately white ones, they have few polling places, they always have lines, and things never go well. When do people locally demand and implement change? This shouldn't be all that hard to accomplish, especially when it's the same places over and over again that have voting problems.