FCS Football in California

[dbackjon]

Currently, there are 3 full-scholarship FCS football team in California (Cal-Poly, UC-Davis and Sac St), and one non-schollie (San Diego).

Given the lack of Division I football in the Golden State (only 7 FBS teams as well), and the fact that in the past 35 years, 10 schools in California DROPPED football, is there any chance of a football comeback?


I'd like to focus my attention on three schools: Pacific, UC-Riverside and Cal St - Bakersfield.

My reasoning behind this is simple - location! It seems to me, that schools located in the Central Valley, away from the ocean stand a much better chance of having support for football. The residents of the Central Valley, from at least my observations, are more football friendly than those on the coast. The Central Valley, with it's agriculture/blue collar roots, is more akin to the Midwest than the latte-liberals/surfers that we commonly associate with California.

Pacific dropped football in 1995, and still has a stadium. No movement is likely to happen until the current President is gone - he started in 1995, and promptly killed football.

Riverside dropped football in 1975, but the Inland Empire area has exploded in growth since then.

Bakersfield has a nice muni stadium, and a rich HS football tradition. Having football at Cal St. Bakersfield seems a natural fit.

So, Golden Staters - any chance of any of these starting football in the next decade? Could a revived Big West football league, with SUU as an associate be possible? Would such a league then be more attractive to Sac State?

[Ibanez]

Lots of crickets in here.......

[Fresno St. Alum]

I guess this thread would be directed towards me since I live in the central valley.

Will it ever make a comeback? No, I don't see it happening in my life time. Reason is that none of the schools that dropped are big time. Long Beach St., Fullerton, UCSB were in UCLA & USC fan areas and they didn't care if the other schools went to a bowl or even played period.

I do think that UC Davis or Sac St. will join the WAC in the next 10 years hurting the FCS in Cali even more.

CS Bakersfield really should have football. The JC has a 20,000 seat stadium and football is huge there.

Pacific has a 30,000 seat stadium and should bring back football.

If any Cali school starts or brings back football my guess is that it would be those 2 schools at the FCS level.

If those 2 started football it could make the GWFC count as a real conference. They should also bring in San Diego with or without schollys GWFC can't be picky right now.

D-II is worse, Humboldt St. is the only FB school in cali.

[dbackjon]

Good response.

We have a few other Central Valley types around - SuperHornet played on the last Pacific team, TravelingMan is a UC Davis fan...

Any thoughts on Riverside?

[travelinman67]

Can't really speak for SoCal other than there's no shortage of players or fans either in the Inland Empire or Northern Valley area. I'll absolutely agree it's a waste of time attempting to develop any more Fball progams in the Coastal area, both due to oversaturation (actually dilution of) fanbase and difficulty finding sufficient eligible players.

Currently, Butte College, College of the Sequoias, and Sierra College (just down the street from my office) are PRIME recruiting Jucos...putting out upper level D1 players every year. Moreso, we have tons of kids coming out of CA who cannot get any attention from FBS schools, that end up at FCS, D2 & 3 schools who are quite capable of being developed into solid FCS level players (and I've seen quite a few over the past decade).

The biggest question is where? I'll agree that the most logical is UC Riverside...with the Inland Empire region growing exponentially, UCR could VERY easily support an FCS program. Next in line, IMHO, would be UOP. It's a shame the program was abandoned, as they had the facilities, location, and like the Inland Empire region, is one of the fastest growing regions in the U.S. Fortunately, the City of Stockton (as well as Modesto) are taking Pro and Semi Pro athletics more seriously than the City/County of Sacramento (largest metro area in the central valley). With their increased attention towards sports, the people of the San Joaquin valley are becoming accustomed to welcoming new teams/programs to the region, so re-introduction of an FCS program at UOP would be reasonably easily accomplished...it just takes the committment of the UOP regents.

I'm clearly sensing a reversal of the PC/Soccer Mom mentality within CA...ten years ago, the Soccer Moms were multiplying like rabbits, but over the past decade, the "cliche" has worn (beaten) them down to a level where overall community support of football programs have been on the rise again. The past two days, I've been debating on a local board a hiring decision about a local HS HC, and at one point, a soccer mom popped in to lecture the participants for taking the schools program/decision too seriously...within 4 hours her post was deleted and she disappeared. That's very indicative of the influence football has within CA (again).

I could talk for days about this, however, I have to take off, so I'll summarize my belief that lobbying will not be enough to persuade/encourage/enact changes within the U.C. system and or the regional college districts to initiate establishing new NCAA programs. The administrators currently in power are carryovers from the Soccer Mom era. They are stubborn, intransigent and ignorant to cultural needs and changes. I've advocated for the past few years a political Renaissance (sorry about that...) with new "players" willing to listen to the voters and take bold action to rebuild and initiate new programs including a committment to establishing new, long-term, athletic programs throughout the state.

(I know, blah, blah, blah... Darn you dback, you knew I couldn't pass this up...)

[dbackjon]

I could talk for days about this,

(I know, blah, blah, blah... Darn you dback, you knew I couldn't pass this up...)

I figured as much And please, do!

You are confirming some of my suspicions - that with the proper leadership/support, FCS football could expand in California. There is definately the talent there.

I don't think a couple more programs would hurt NAU's recruiting much. Sure, we'd lose a few, but NAU is close enough that we'd still do fine. The losers would be the D-2s, and the schools further away from Cal.

[dbackjon]

BTW:
Bakersfield - Flagstaff: 480 miles (almost all good freeway)
Riverside - Flagstaff: 430 miles (all freeway)
Riverside - Sacramento: 440 miles
Riverside - Bakersfield: 167 miles
Riverside - Stockton: 400 miles

Riverside and Bakersfield are closer to NAU (by far) than any Big Sky team.
Only Weber is closer than Stockton.

[AZGrizFan]

It's absolutely appalling that in the second (I think) most populous state in the UNION there are only 10 college football teams at the D-I level.

[travelinman67]

Riversides the most logical...it's an easy drive from anywhere in SoCal...but more importantly, Riverside wouldn't really need to pull out of area to fill a 20k stadium. Don't know when the last time you were down in Riverside, but from Fallbrook all the way up to San Bernadino, the whole I-15/I-10 corridor is either developed or under development (have quite a few clients in the region). More importantly, there's easy air access through Ontario; Easy hwy access from E-W on 10, and from the N. by veh, Sac/UCD would take 5 south to the 10 cutoff, then it's only another 45 min. Additionally, (breath in....), the demographics of the region look fantastic for Football...low-middle to middle class, blue collar, younger couples with family, no attendance competition with professional teams, it just goes on and on. It really is a no-brainer other than getting the regents to pitch in with the finances to establish the program, which in CA is a curse as they RELIGIOUSLY enforce Title IV match (don't get me started...what the Title IV advocates seem to have trouble understanding is that establishing an FCS or FBS program ultimately ends up INCREASING FUNDING for Title IV, if not from Regents, then from facilities investments from private sector contributors. Call it what you will, but if i was running a womens athletic program, I'd rather have a "hand me down" 24,000sf state of the art training facility than an aging 5,000sf under-equipped facility. And by digging their heels in and demanding matches at the time of budgeting, they end up hurting ALL THEIR PROGRAMS. ...IMHO.)
Anyway, I'll take a breather from this...will be back after I get some food and booze in me.

[dbackjon]

It's absolutely appalling that in the second (I think) most populous state in the UNION there are only 10 college football teams at the D-I level.

California is by far the most populous state - 36 million
Texas is far back in second with 23 million

Texas D-I schools with football:

Texas St - Southland
SHSU - Southland
SFA - Southland
PVA&M - SWAC
Texas Southen - SWAC

Lamar is adding football
UTSA may add football

Texas - Big 12
Texas A&M - Big 12
Texas Tech - Big 12
Baylor - Big 12
TCU - Mountain West
UTEP - C-USA
Rice - C-USA
Houston - C-USA
SMU - C-USA
North Texas - SunBelt

[travelinman67]

It's absolutely appalling that in the second (I think) most populous state in the UNION there are only 10 college football teams at the D-I level.

What's worse is the number of potential recruits that get passed over. With the exception of skills positions, the farther from CA the school, the less chance the school will even consider them. I've spoken to many TX, SEast and Midwest schools who flat say they won't recruit in CA (albeit the player/coach can obviously contact them), and cannot consider CA players for schollies. Worse, was told by a 9-13 (2yr record) assistant at an FBS school they only recruited within a 300 mi radius, per the A.D.'s direction (presumably under alum pressure), who that same year then went 1-11 (...figure out who yet?), and promptly fired the HC at the end of the season. The new coach...has been told the A.D. will provide recruiting budget for a 300 mi. radius...
Bottomline is, CA could within the near future, if available, provide players for twice as many D1 programs as it currently has. I always get a kick out of going around to the summer camps at Cal, USC, Oregon, UW...when you see how much talent is sitting there...at the Oregon and UW camps alone, every summer, there are 20-50 with D1 skills/athleticism. At Cal, a little less, and USC has enough to field two full starting teams. Watched a CA DT knock the snot out of every OL at an Oregon camp (no, dback...not THAT one...), yet 3 of the OL present end up schollied in the NW, and the CA DT ended up at a community college in CA. I know I sound like a bitter ahole, but the point is, as both dback and AZGriz have pointed out, CA is woefully underrepresented in D1 athletics, not due to lack of talent, but rather a shortage of available programs.

/rant>pause

[Fresno St. Alum]

Don't forget Reedley College(JUCO National/State Champs 2002) & Fresno City as major JUCO recruiting grounds for pacific time zone schools.

Did you guys read or hear something about UCR starting football? This is news to me. Do they have a stadium on or near the campus? CSUB & UOP have stadiums close by and on campus.

All I've heard about Cali schools lately is that UCSD voted to increase fees to eventually move to D-I.
Also heard that CS San Marcos (opened in 1989) was going to add basketball and move to D-II. CS Channel Islands (opened in 2002) was also looking to start sports and join D-II.

I also talked to the President at UC Merced (opened in 2005) and he said it would be 5-10 years before they started sports and when they did it would probably be D-III. Yuck, I hope they at least go D-II and join the CCAA.

[dbackjon]

Did you guys read or hear something about UCR starting football? This is news to me. Do they have a stadium on or near the campus? CSUB & UOP have stadiums close by and on campus.

.

This is pure speculation, FSA. UCR would be the logical place to start football, that is all.

[SuperHornet]

Jon,

I don't know where you got Riverside and Bako from. Riverside is barely treading water in D-I outside of baseball and WBB, and Bako is just transitioning.

On the rare occasions that anyone bothers to speculate, it focuses on UOP, JRCC (aka UCSB), and CS Foolerton, and, perhaps Long Beach. There's also been talk of SJSU dropping to FCS. But regardless of which BW school you talk about, the school presidents (particularly that lying SOB Don de Rosa and his sycophant AD Lynn King at UOP) are dead set against the return of football. Not going to happen with that nincompoop Dennis Farrell in the league office, either. He forced his bogus dream of a California Bus League on BW fans, thereby eliminating what little regional exposure we had.

That said, Jon, if we could dump the inmates running the asylum, I'd love to see it.

[Fresno St. Alum]

looks like SuperHornet is backing up what I said in the 1st part of my 1st post on this thread.

I would like to see Humboldt St. move to D-I since they are the only D-II school in Cali with football. But since the BW will have 10 when CSUB joins they'd need to convice them to go to 12 to get in. Or join they SKY, but if they SKY went to 10 it would probably be with SUU.

[AZGrizFan]

looks like SuperHornet is backing up what I said in the 1st part of my 1st post on this thread.

I would like to see Humboldt St. move to D-I since they are the only D-II school in Cali with football. But since the BW will have 10 when CSUB joins they'd need to convice them to go to 12 to get in. Or join they SKY, but if they SKY went to 10 it would probably be with SUU.

Jesus, I hope not. UNC is bad enough. Honestly, I'd rather go straight for USD and UND.

[Fresno St. Alum]

I don't think the others would want to travel that far east. Plus UND & USD would probably want to stick together. SUU isn't winning but at least they are competitive. UNC isn't competitive. If SUU went to the SKY they could get better recruits.

[travelinman67]

Jon,

I don't know where you got Riverside and Bako from. Riverside is barely treading water in D-I outside of baseball and WBB, and Bako is just transitioning.

On the rare occasions that anyone bothers to speculate, it focuses on UOP, JRCC (aka UCSB), and CS Foolerton, and, perhaps Long Beach. There's also been talk of SJSU dropping to FCS. But regardless of which BW school you talk about, the school presidents (particularly that lying SOB Don de Rosa and his sycophant AD Lynn King at UOP) are dead set against the return of football. Not going to happen with that nincompoop Dennis Farrell in the league office, either. He forced his bogus dream of a California Bus League on BW fans, thereby eliminating what little regional exposure we had.

That said, Jon, if we could dump the inmates running the asylum, I'd love to see it.

My reasoning for selecting UCR and UOP is strictly based on logistics...growth, demographics, access, etc...any school can build facilities, hire good personnel and recruit statewide...but they have to be in a location that can realistically support a D1 program.

Humboldt USED to have a pretty serious program, but if for no other reason than logistics, I don't see them taking off...know a DII-D1 OL who was considering Humboldt...then made the drive...just figured he couldn't deal with that for 4 years. (Maybe if Humboldt/Arcata Airport continues expanding...Delta joins Horizon and UA with commuter commercial svc. on June 5, and Horizon is establishing LAX as a main hub this year...adding a ton of regionals in and out of LAX...including Flagstaff. Ergo, a SW based schedule would reasonably work well for Humboldt.) Anyway, there has to be enough regional investment and fan base to support a D1 pgm, and although that region doesn't really have anything else...I still don't see Humboldt at the same level as UCR or UOP.
As for UOP's pack-o'-losers...note what I observed in my previous post...

"I could talk for days about this, however, I have to take off, so I'll summarize my belief that lobbying will not be enough to persuade/encourage/enact changes within the U.C. system and or the regional college districts to initiate establishing new NCAA programs. The administrators currently in power are carryovers from the Soccer Mom era. They are stubborn, intransigent and ignorant to cultural needs and changes. I've advocated for the past few years a political Renaissance (sorry about that...) with new "players" willing to listen to the voters and take bold action to rebuild and initiate new programs including a committment to establishing new, long-term, athletic programs throughout the state.”

I know it’s not a pleasant suggestion and an even less pleasant battle to wage, but IMHO, there needs to be a massive, rapid replacement of leaders at the UC/CSU regents, many university presidents and most of the A.D.’s. I doubt the purging would have to be complete as once the dinosaurs see their own neck will be on the chopping block if they fail to start listening…the “problem” would quickly rectify itself.

IMHO

[dbackjon]

Jon,

I don't know where you got Riverside and Bako from. Riverside is barely treading water in D-I outside of baseball and WBB, and Bako is just transitioning.

On the rare occasions that anyone bothers to speculate, it focuses on UOP, JRCC (aka UCSB), and CS Foolerton, and, perhaps Long Beach. There's also been talk of SJSU dropping to FCS. But regardless of which BW school you talk about, the school presidents (particularly that lying SOB Don de Rosa and his sycophant AD Lynn King at UOP) are dead set against the return of football. Not going to happen with that nincompoop Dennis Farrell in the league office, either. He forced his bogus dream of a California Bus League on BW fans, thereby eliminating what little regional exposure we had.

That said, Jon, if we could dump the inmates running the asylum, I'd love to see it.

The reason I picked Riverside, UOP and Bakersfield was demographics - I just see those areas are being much more football friendly/suppportive than the coastal areas. As Tman said, the locales around the schools have great potential to support football.

For Riverside, it could be a way to connect with the community, and set it apart from the other state schools in SoCal. I really think they could make a go of it, and have good support, if they did it properly.