Should NDSU move to the MAC?

[AZGrizFan]

I sense that FargoBison realizes a move to the FBS is good for NDSU. Its a football centric move because baskeball has no sub classes. The FBS represents the top of the NCAA Division 1 football.

I know there has been a lot of talk in Fargo about the WAC. If its the WAC so be it, but if its the MAC thats fine too.

The most important thing is the vision to see the way. NDSU and Fargo should have an FBS football team with a stadium large enough to host the Big 10 and Big 12 teams. I feel its a manifest destiny and I know others, including Coach Bohl feel the same way.

I saw the entire UND organization, some BISON fans and lots of NCC members laugh at the Mighty Land Grants when they announced the move to Division 1. I heard the same kind of talk I now hear from many of you. Obviously they were wrong and I think the denigrators exposing themselves here are wrong.

Your team is barely playoff eligible and you're already pushing for ANOTHER move?

[Col Hogan]

I sense that FargoBison realizes a move to the FBS is good for NDSU. Its a football centric move because baskeball has no sub classes. The FBS represents the top of the NCAA Division 1 football.

I know there has been a lot of talk in Fargo about the WAC. If its the WAC so be it, but if its the MAC thats fine too.

The most important thing is the vision to see the way. NDSU and Fargo should have an FBS football team with a stadium large enough to host the Big 10 and Big 12 teams. I feel its a manifest destiny and I know others, including Coach Bohl feel the same way.

I saw the entire UND organization, some BISON fans and lots of NCC members laugh at the Mighty Land Grants when they announced the move to Division 1. I heard the same kind of talk I now hear from many of you. Obviously they were wrong and I think the denigrators exposing themselves here are wrong.

Are you familiar with "The Peter Principle"???

If NDSU goes FBS, you will be a victim of "The Peter Principle"....in fact, your move to FCS might have already made you a victim...

[JayJ79]

Are you familiar with "The Peter Principle"???

is that a title from the Capn's video collection?

[TwinTownBisonFan]

some science for you JBB

1. Fargo is a negligible media market - not one to be coveted by... much of anyone
2. the distance from NDSU to NIU - the NEAREST MAC team is 600 miles by road... why the hell would they want a member of their conference that far removed from their membership?
3. the move to FCS already put a strain on resources - this was a good thing - but moving again is unsustainable
4. if you look at NDSU's recruiting we have to go to St. Louis, Milwaukee and Texas to find enough D-I talent as it is... that'll just be exacerbated in FBS - there is, put simply - not enough D-I talent in the Minn-Kota region for even ONE FBS program (Minnesota is at best a middling program - that, despite a new stadium still struggles to get elite recruits)
5. the teams that HAVE gone to the FBS recently ACTUALLY FUCKING PROVED SOMETHING AT THE FCS LEVEL. WKU, Marshall, even Troy... for chrissakes let's have the Bison find any measure of success in FCS before pronouncing "we might as well"...

[Mike Johnson]

Its just one more reason for NDSU to gear up for a move to the MAC, not the only one.

Unfortunately, none of your reason held any merit.

[JBB]

I know this: The Fargo Metro and BISON Athletics have a big media market. I also know this: If you dont sell nobody is buying.

NDSU needs to move football to the FBS,

Our other sports are comfortable with their markets. Volleyball is doing very well. Basketball is strong and the MAC and Summit are good spots. The WAC would be good too. Football is being held back. As good of conference as the MVFC is, NDSU has a larger market. The way it is now things wont change. NDSU needs a 50,000 seat stadium. We need Iowa State, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wyoming, BYU, Notre Dame and anybody else that thinks they want to play in Fargo to have a place to play. We arent going to get that in the MVFC.

[SuperHornet]

NDSU in the MAC is really no different than NDSU in the MVFC. In addition we bring proximity to the Big 10 and existing relationships with the Big 10. We would also project the MAC presence west and have established a connection with the Big 12.

#bs

What relationships with the Big Ten? What connections with the Big XII? That sounds about as far fetched as Sac State having relationships with the Pac-10. Oh, wait. That's actually true. We DO have relationships with the Pac-10 through the MPSF. Outside of maybe hockey, what relationships does NDSU already have wtih the Big Ten (Ahem, Eleven) or the Big XII?

Actually, if you want to extend that comparison a bit, do you think NDSU might be able to forge relationships in the WAC? Well, Sac State has beaten you to it. Sac State is IN the WAC and has been for years. In fact, we're not too far removed from back-to-back WAC titles for Sac State. How bout THEM apples?

NDSU is a highly visible program.

Highly visible, my foot. I wonder how many here even heard of NDSU before the FCS move. Not many, I can assure you. Weber State is visible because they knocked off North Carolina in the NCAAs. NDSU can't say anything like that.

[bench]

I know this: The Fargo Metro and BISON Athletics have a big media market. I also know this: If you dont sell nobody is buying.

NDSU needs to move football to the FBS,

Our other sports are comfortable with their markets. Volleyball is doing very well. Basketball is strong and the MAC and Summit are good spots. The WAC would be good too. Football is being held back. As good of conference as the MVFC is, NDSU has a larger market. The way it is now things wont change. NDSU needs a 50,000 seat stadium. We need Iowa State, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wyoming, BYU, Notre Dame and anybody else that thinks they want to play in Fargo to have a place to play. We arent going to get that in the MVFC.

Just think of all the invaluable exposure a small, relatively-obscure Catholic school like Notre Dame would receive from playing on the Big Stage in the crucial Fargo media market. Also, WOW HEY LOOK A UNICORN JUST TOOK A MAGICAL SHIT IN MY FRONT YARD

I honestly don't expect you to quit saying stupid things with that stupid mouth of yours, or at least any time soon, but at some point I would assume you would learn well enough to stop sharing those stupid things with the rest of us

[Hambone]

I know this: The Fargo Metro and BISON Athletics have a big media market. I also know this: If you dont sell nobody is buying.

NDSU needs to move football to the FBS,

Our other sports are comfortable with their markets. Volleyball is doing very well. Basketball is strong and the MAC and Summit are good spots. The WAC would be good too. Football is being held back. As good of conference as the MVFC is, NDSU has a larger market. The way it is now things wont change. NDSU needs a 50,000 seat stadium. We need Iowa State, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wyoming, BYU, Notre Dame and anybody else that thinks they want to play in Fargo to have a place to play. We arent going to get that in the MVFC.

So, how are Florida, Alabama, Texas, etc going to win the national title without going through Fargo???? Everyone is begging to get a piece of that huge market, and I'm trying to figure out how anyone can operate without that critical market in hand. I guess I did hear that Notre Dame was clamoring for a game in Fargo, but they didn't have a big enough stadium and thought "if only NDSU was in the MAC, then maybe they'd let us play there".

Do you see how much sense you might be making????

[houndawg]

I know this: The Fargo Metro and BISON Athletics have a big media market. I also know this: If you dont sell nobody is buying.

NDSU needs to move football to the FBS,

Our other sports are comfortable with their markets. Volleyball is doing very well. Basketball is strong and the MAC and Summit are good spots. The WAC would be good too. Football is being held back. As good of conference as the MVFC is, NDSU has a larger market. The way it is now things wont change. NDSU needs a 50,000 seat stadium. We need Iowa State, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wyoming, BYU, Notre Dame and anybody else that thinks they want to play in Fargo to have a place to play. We arent going to get that in the MVFC.

Just think of all the invaluable exposure a small, relatively-obscure Catholic school like Notre Dame would receive from playing on the Big Stage in the crucial Fargo media market. Also, WOW HEY LOOK A UNICORN JUST TOOK A MAGICAL **** IN MY FRONT YARD

I honestly don't expect you to quit saying stupid things with that stupid mouth of yours, or at least any time soon, but at some point I would assume you would learn well enough to stop sharing those stupid things with the rest of us

He has a right to say stupid things, even a right to share them. What annoys me is the way he abuses the privledge.

[Col Hogan]

I know this: The Fargo Metro and BISON Athletics have a big media market. I also know this: If you dont sell nobody is buying.

NDSU needs to move football to the FBS,

Our other sports are comfortable with their markets. Volleyball is doing very well. Basketball is strong and the MAC and Summit are good spots. The WAC would be good too. Football is being held back. As good of conference as the MVFC is, NDSU has a larger market. The way it is now things wont change. NDSU needs a 50,000 seat stadium. We need Iowa State, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wyoming, BYU, Notre Dame and anybody else that thinks they want to play in Fargo to have a place to play. We arent going to get that in the MVFC.

[GoApps70]

But.....it depends on WHAT you are selling.....
Big difference between selling s$$t and Shinola.

[DJH]

lol at this thread. JBB, you are wrong about every single thing you have said, and not one person here thinks otherwise.

[rowdy]

NDSU in the MAC is really no different than NDSU in the MVFC. In addition we bring proximity to the Big 10 and existing relationships with the Big 10. We would also project the MAC presence west and have established a connection with the Big 12.

NDSU would bring the MAC media presence all the way to Fargo and beyond which would increase the MAC visibility tremendously.

Draw a cricle around the MAC without NDSU and then with NDSU. You can begin to see what marketing advantages the conference would gain. NDSU is a highly visible program. Losing aside, we bring a lot of media presence with us.

I see your point of view for wanting your school to move onto a bigger stage; but I dont feel like the MAC would be a logical fit. First off, I dont see NDSU bringing anything to the MAC. They may need another team, but not NDSU. Also they have more competition in the MVFS and arent at the same level with the SIU, SDSU, UNI, MO ST is on the way back up, YSU...if they can become a fixture in the MVFS and FCS overall, they might be able to look at a move in the future...but still not the MAC. YSU would be a more practical choice for expanding if they want to bring someone up to join

[JBB]

I can see a lot of you have no idea what Im talking about. Some of you have no idea what you are talking about. Im not inventing the steam engine here. Im talking about a college athletic program growing into its own market.

I have been reading about the MEAC and the announcement by the league they are trying to set up a bowl game. This game would pay out $1 million or so to the participating conferences. Im not sure which conferences they want to participate but it will be called the Heritage bowl. Naturally this is in response to the lack of payout in the FCS playoffs.

I can see the idea of a program or fan looking past what many of you think is the epitome of college football offends you, but it is simply a realistic choice of what is best. For NDSU its best to grow into the market. I have no illusions its going to happen this summer but its a goal for us and I think it is the goal driving the football program right now.

All of the negatives were spewed by someone or another when NDSU was talking about getting out of D2. Tremendous resistance from fans of the established powers, negative talk similar to what I read here. Even resistance from our own fans. We heard it all. The market was too small. No league would want to travel to Fargo, on and on and on. Some of you must simply be regurgitating your own posts from those days?

I sense resentment from a lot of you, a resistance to look at this realistically and a total lack of objective thinking. Ask the UND fans who had a lot worse things to say about NDSU decision to move. Its easy to amuse yourself and the rest of the oblique minds and still be wrong. I think the FCS is in trouble long term. Playoffs are money losers, the division lacks fan support and the programs are expensive to maintain.

Right now I pick up the paper and read a UND sports correspondent, Ryan Bakken, explaining to the world that UNDs attendance is so bad and NDSUs is so good because UND fans are more sophisticated. They arent impressed by the Cal Polys and Stony Brooks because they have D1 hockey. NDSU fans on the other hand are unsophisticated because they continue to come out in large numbers to see these types of teams. Well I guess with that and the comments I read here convoluted thinking comes at you from both sides. I guess I dont understand football because NDSU has demonstrated a market thats larger than the FCS but NDSU fans as a whole are unsophisticated because they turn out in such large numbers for the FCS. Oh well.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

some science for you JBB

1. Fargo is a negligible media market - not one to be coveted by... much of anyone
2. the distance from NDSU to NIU - the NEAREST MAC team is 600 miles by road... why the hell would they want a member of their conference that far removed from their membership?
3. the move to FCS already put a strain on resources - this was a good thing - but moving again is unsustainable
4. if you look at NDSU's recruiting we have to go to St. Louis, Milwaukee and Texas to find enough D-I talent as it is... that'll just be exacerbated in FBS - there is, put simply - not enough D-I talent in the Minn-Kota region for even ONE FBS program (Minnesota is at best a middling program - that, despite a new stadium still struggles to get elite recruits)
5. the teams that HAVE gone to the FBS recently ACTUALLY FUCKING PROVED SOMETHING AT THE FCS LEVEL. WKU, Marshall, even Troy... for chrissakes let's have the Bison find any measure of success in FCS before pronouncing "we might as well"...

On the upside though with the MAC turning down NDSU's advances would allow NDSU fans to claim that NIU was afraid of them and didn't want them in the conference because NIU was afraid of them and didn't want to share the MAC pie with NDSU.

The more things change...

[JBB]

TT you are joking right? That is Ryan Bakkans column from 8 years ago explaining to NDSU why they shouldnt move up and why UND was staying D2.

The rest of you are the elite of the FCS fan base?

[Willie]

TT you are joking right? That is Ryan Bakkans column from 8 years ago explaining to NDSU why they shouldnt move up and why UND was staying D2.

The rest of you are the elite of the FCS fan base?

Just give this a rest before you really get shredded. It can and will get ugly fast.

[JBB]

Its alread ugly and thats not a reflection on me. Its a reflection on the big thinkers I encountered here when trying to engage these elite fans in a conversation about FBS/bowls and FCS/playoffs and NDSUs future as well as everyones future. Your not smart willie, your just a street fighter.

[houndawg]

I can see a lot of you have no idea what Im talking about. Some of you have no idea what you are talking about. Im not inventing the steam engine here. Im talking about a college athletic program growing into its own market.

I have been reading about the MEAC and the announcement by the league they are trying to set up a bowl game. This game would pay out $1 million or so to the participating conferences. Im not sure which conferences they want to participate but it will be called the Heritage bowl. Naturally this is in response to the lack of payout in the FCS playoffs.

I can see the idea of a program or fan looking past what many of you think is the epitome of college football offends you, but it is simply a realistic choice of what is best. For NDSU its best to grow into the market. I have no illusions its going to happen this summer but its a goal for us and I think it is the goal driving the football program right now.

All of the negatives were spewed by someone or another when NDSU was talking about getting out of D2. Tremendous resistance from fans of the established powers, negative talk similar to what I read here. Even resistance from our own fans. We heard it all. The market was too small. No league would want to travel to Fargo, on and on and on. Some of you must simply be regurgitating your own posts from those days?

I sense resentment from a lot of you, a resistance to look at this realistically and a total lack of objective thinking. Ask the UND fans who had a lot worse things to say about NDSU decision to move. Its easy to amuse yourself and the rest of the oblique minds and still be wrong. I think the FCS is in trouble long term. Playoffs are money losers, the division lacks fan support and the programs are expensive to maintain.

Right now I pick up the paper and read a UND sports correspondent, Ryan Bakken, explaining to the world that UNDs attendance is so bad and NDSUs is so good because UND fans are more sophisticated. They arent impressed by the Cal Polys and Stony Brooks because they have D1 hockey. NDSU fans on the other hand are unsophisticated because they continue to come out in large numbers to see these types of teams. Well I guess with that and the comments I read here convoluted thinking comes at you from both sides. I guess I dont understand football because NDSU has demonstrated a market thats larger than the FCS but NDSU fans as a whole are unsophisticated because they turn out in such large numbers for the FCS. Oh well.

No resentment here, jbb, other than resenting you guys stinking up the MVC this year and lowering our conference rep..


The major flaw with your arguement is that nobody wants your product.

[Willie]

Its alread ugly and thats not a reflection on me. Its a reflection on the big thinkers I encountered here when trying to engage these elite fans in a conversation about FBS/bowls and FCS/playoffs and NDSUs future as well as everyones future. Your not smart willie, your just a street fighter.

[DJH]

JBB, were your parents brother and sister, and also bad at the internet? Just wondering.

[JBB]

Ill just let that go and let you and your comment stand on its own.

[JBB]

houndawg,

You mean nobody here is buying. That doesnt bother me. These folks have already demonstrated their intellect and I agree with the first impression of them. I also see none are buying the vision for NDSU and the future of the FCS. The bigger markets are going to leave. I just hope NDSU makes the cut. If half of the MVFC can make it in the FCS with 9,000 fans/game or LESS NDSU can make it in the FCS with 18,000.

[bench]

It has occurred to me that this whole thing is just a well-crafted PR campaign designed to make MplsBison look astute and reasonable by comparison