Question for all the Big Sky homers on this board:

[Skjellyfetti]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

[Mvemjsunpx]

No, but the Sky does play offense.


The Big Sky averaged 31.3 ppg even with a team getting shut out (UM & EWU averaged 47).

The CAA looked good in averaging 35.25 ppg.

The SoCon, on the other hand, averaged just 16.5 ppg.




Seriously, though, this is nowhere near the insanity of the Big Sky in the late '80s/early '90s.

[fencer24]

Maybe the other conferences don't play offense?

[SouthDakotaGrizzly]

No, but the Sky does play offense.


The Big Sky averaged 31.3 ppg even with a team getting shut out (UM & EWU averaged 47).

The CAA looked good in averaging 35.25 ppg.

The SoCon, on the other hand, averaged just 16.5 ppg.




Seriously, though, this is nowhere near the insanity of the Big Sky in the late '80s/early '90s.

He's right. The Big Sky has more teams that sling the ball 50 times a game and do it well (such as EWU, NAU, and Weber). The other conferences seem to be more run oriented, which doesn't tend to generate as many points.

This is one of the reasons I think that Montana has an advantage over SFA this weekend. SFA would fit right in in the Big Sky...their offense is nothing the Griz haven't seen before. I'd much prefer they face a wide open passing offense like SFA's than an option offense (Wofford '07) that they've never seen before and have only one week to prepare for. We all know how that worked out.

[GrizMonster]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

yes it does...


In fact, In the first round we gave up less yards then Villanova, New Hampshire, SFA, and Richmond. The Big Sky just has way more offense. EWU lost, and had more yards than App and SCSU combined. Which seems awfully out of sorts for you guys. Is that really all do to Armanti being hurt?

[SeattleGriz]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

Ha! That is exactly what I was thinking about the SoCon the last couple of years until Wofford came up and played Montana. I then realized the SoCon does play defense, just everyone's offense was geared in the SoCon to take advantage of a conferences weak points.

Pretty much the same with the Big Sky.

One thing to remember as well. When Montana won the national championship 13-6 over Furman, I remember how everyone in the SoCon was incredulous that Montana actually played defense because they had given up so much yardage that season.

[siuham]

A big problem with the first post's stats are the fact that a lot of points were scored off turnovers. It's still kinda bad, but, meh.

But if you wanna look at it like that, the MVFC averaged 48 points scored per game.

[GrizMonster]

A big problem with the first post's stats are the fact that a lot of points were scored off turnovers. It's still kinda bad, but, meh.

But if you wanna look at it like that, the MVFC averaged 48 points scored per game.

Exactly, The Griz defense didn't actually do that bad.

Here are the total yards allowed by the winning teams defenses:

W&M: 161

SIU:189

App State: 229 (this one looks like a defensive struggle, as there were less yards by both teams combined than there were by either EWU or SFA)

UM: 324

UNH: 326

Richmond: 336

Villanova 393

SFA: 595

The Griz defense appears to have outperformed Villanova, Richmond, New Hampshire, and SFA. The score doesn't really tell the whole story.

[weberwildcat]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

I don't consider my self a big sky homer though i am a big sky fan. Don't you know any thing about football out here????

thats how we roll out west dog! the wac, mtn west, pac10 n big sky have played this way for yrs!

its all about the high flying offense! we like our fball like our bball - a lot of points! lol for example my team beat portland state in 2007 73-68. the losing QB had 9 TD passes.

ever heard of Bill Walsh or the west coast offense? its not called the east coast offense. LOL
ever heard of mouse davis? he's never been east of the mississippi! same with Lavell Edwards from BYU.

[wideright82]

A big problem with the first post's stats are the fact that a lot of points were scored off turnovers. It's still kinda bad, but, meh.

But if you wanna look at it like that, the MVFC averaged 48 points scored per game.

Exactly, The Griz defense didn't actually do that bad.

Here are the total yards allowed by the winning teams defenses:

W&M: 161

SIU:189

App State: 229 (this one looks like a defensive struggle, as there were less yards by both teams combined than there were by either EWU or SFA)

UM: 324

UNH: 326

Richmond: 336

Villanova 393

SFA: 595

The Griz defense appears to have outperformed Villanova, Richmond, New Hampshire, and SFA. The score doesn't really tell the whole story.

Neither does the yardage, however. You gave them short fields a couple of times. Just because the team can't physically drive the ball 80 yards doesn't mean their 40 yard TD drive was good defense.

Villanova and HC had ZERO turnovers so they had the whole field to drive every time. That's why Villanova put up 530 yards of offense.

[wideright82]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

I don't consider my self a big sky homer though i am a big sky fan. Don't you know any thing about football out here????

thats how we roll out west dog! the wac, mtn west, pac10 n big sky have played this way for yrs!

its all about the high flying offense! we like our fball like our bball - a lot of points! lol for example my team beat portland state in 2007 73-68. the losing QB had 9 TD passes.

ever heard of Bill Walsh or the west coast offense? its not called the east coast offense. LOL
ever heard of mouse davis? he's never been east of the mississippi! same with Lavell Edwards from BYU.

This answer is more like it!

[Grizalltheway]

Exactly, The Griz defense didn't actually do that bad.

Here are the total yards allowed by the winning teams defenses:

W&M: 161

SIU:189

App State: 229 (this one looks like a defensive struggle, as there were less yards by both teams combined than there were by either EWU or SFA)

UM: 324

UNH: 326

Richmond: 336

Villanova 393

SFA: 595

The Griz defense appears to have outperformed Villanova, Richmond, New Hampshire, and SFA. The score doesn't really tell the whole story.

Neither does the yardage, however. You gave them short fields a couple of times. Just because the team can't physically drive the ball 80 yards doesn't mean their 40 yard TD drive was good defense.

Villanova and HC had ZERO turnovers so they had the whole field to drive every time. That's why Villanova put up 530 yards of offense.

You want a cookie, or what? Bottom line, you only beat a PATRIOT LEAGUE team by 10, at home.

[wideright82]

Neither does the yardage, however. You gave them short fields a couple of times. Just because the team can't physically drive the ball 80 yards doesn't mean their 40 yard TD drive was good defense.

Villanova and HC had ZERO turnovers so they had the whole field to drive every time. That's why Villanova put up 530 yards of offense.

You want a cookie, or what? Bottom line, you only beat a PATRIOT LEAGUE team by 10, at home.

Lighten up, Francis. I was merely pointing out the flaw in your compadre's argument not making an argument for Villanova.



I would also go out on a limb and say Dom Randolf is a better QB than anyone in the Big Sky (Probably nation for pure QB and not an Armanti). Personal opinion only, though.

[GrizMonster]

Exactly, The Griz defense didn't actually do that bad.

Here are the total yards allowed by the winning teams defenses:

W&M: 161

SIU:189

App State: 229 (this one looks like a defensive struggle, as there were less yards by both teams combined than there were by either EWU or SFA)

UM: 324

UNH: 326

Richmond: 336

Villanova 393

SFA: 595

The Griz defense appears to have outperformed Villanova, Richmond, New Hampshire, and SFA. The score doesn't really tell the whole story.

Neither does the yardage, however. You gave them short fields a couple of times. Just because the team can't physically drive the ball 80 yards doesn't mean their 40 yard TD drive was good defense.

Villanova and HC had ZERO turnovers so they had the whole field to drive every time. That's why Villanova put up 530 yards of offense.

Well, SDSU had one long scoring drive the whole game, and that was due to a huge play action pass in the second half. Otherwise they had a really, really, really short field. One of their other touchdowns was on a blocked punt. This is pretty telling. Its from an Argus Leader article called the Meltdown in Montana:

"In the span between Mariani's kick return and when Montana pulled even at 48-48, SDSU took 13 snaps and ran the ball 11 times. The Jacks had four penalties during that stretch (three false starts) and punted on all three series.

In fact, the final six SDSU possessions looked like this: punt, punt, punt, punt, interception, interception."

and this from the same article:

"If you take away Fox's 61-yard pass reception, the Jacks gained just 67 yards in the second half - compared with 296 for Montana. For the game, SDSU was just 1-for-12 on third-down conversions."

1 for 12 on 3rd down is a pretty good defensive effort.

[wideright82]

Neither does the yardage, however. You gave them short fields a couple of times. Just because the team can't physically drive the ball 80 yards doesn't mean their 40 yard TD drive was good defense.

Villanova and HC had ZERO turnovers so they had the whole field to drive every time. That's why Villanova put up 530 yards of offense.

Well, SDSU had one long scoring drive the whole game, and that was due to a huge play action pass in the second half. Otherwise they had a really, really, really short field. One of their other touchdowns was on a blocked punt. This is pretty telling. Its from an Argus Leader article called the Meltdown in Montana:

"In the span between Mariani's kick return and when Montana pulled even at 48-48, SDSU took 13 snaps and ran the ball 11 times. The Jacks had four penalties during that stretch (three false starts) and punted on all three series.

In fact, the final six SDSU possessions looked like this: punt, punt, punt, punt, interception, interception."

and this from the same article:

"If you take away Fox's 61-yard pass reception, the Jacks gained just 67 yards in the second half - compared with 296 for Montana. For the game, SDSU was just 1-for-12 on third-down conversions."

1 for 12 on 3rd down is a pretty good defensive effort.

I never said Montana didn't play good defense. Just stating that yardage doesn't tell the whole story. Which was the only thing used as an arguement. Let's all learn how to use logical arguments in a logical progression so there are no misunderstandings. Your point is not wrong (Montana playing defense), the logic used to support it, however, is completely misleading.

[andy7171]

Maybe the other conferences don't play offense?

Did Weber play offense last Saturday?

[SouthDakotaGrizzly]

Maybe the other conferences don't play offense?

Did Weber play offense last Saturday?

Good point. Weber is one of those teams that can put up 40+ points easily when all cylinders are firing, but when they aren't, it ain't pretty. Against Montana and W&M this year, the cylinders were seized.

[GrizMonster]

Well, SDSU had one long scoring drive the whole game, and that was due to a huge play action pass in the second half. Otherwise they had a really, really, really short field. One of their other touchdowns was on a blocked punt. This is pretty telling. Its from an Argus Leader article called the Meltdown in Montana:

"In the span between Mariani's kick return and when Montana pulled even at 48-48, SDSU took 13 snaps and ran the ball 11 times. The Jacks had four penalties during that stretch (three false starts) and punted on all three series.

In fact, the final six SDSU possessions looked like this: punt, punt, punt, punt, interception, interception."

and this from the same article:

"If you take away Fox's 61-yard pass reception, the Jacks gained just 67 yards in the second half - compared with 296 for Montana. For the game, SDSU was just 1-for-12 on third-down conversions."

1 for 12 on 3rd down is a pretty good defensive effort.

I never said Montana didn't play good defense. Just stating that yardage doesn't tell the whole story. Which was the only thing used as an arguement. Let's all learn how to use logical arguments in a logical progression so there are no misunderstandings. Your point is not wrong (Montana playing defense), the logic used to support it, however, is completely misleading.

I definitely agree. My argument wasn't really directed at you, rather that it was an anomaly that 48 points was scored, and the defensive stats didn't reflect the score. Nor was it an indictment about Villanova's defensive effort, my point was that the stats rather than just the final score needed to be looked at. The SDSU game was really weird all around. We had more offensive production against Idaho State..but scored 61 points.

[Grizalltheway]

You want a cookie, or what? Bottom line, you only beat a PATRIOT LEAGUE team by 10, at home.

Lighten up, Francis. I was merely pointing out the flaw in your compadre's argument not making an argument for Villanova.




I would also go out on a limb and say Dom Randolf is a better QB than anyone in the Big Sky (Probably nation for pure QB and not an Armanti). Personal opinion only, though.

Hadn't had my yet. Plus, I'll never miss a chance to take a shot at the CAA.

Oh, and Nichols finished fourth in Payton voting. Not sure where Randolf was.

[kalm]

EWU is guilty of a lack of D as much as anyone and it starts at the line of scrimmage with d ends that are barely over a 200 lbs and are the size of PAC 10 safeties. So when we face big physical o lines like Montana and Weber State they try to grind it out and keep our offense off the field.

I don't think it's coincidence with Montana's success that they also typically have the best defense and best o line. Montana State, Weber and UNC have been making strides in these categories. We need to be doing the same, both from a standpoint of beating Montana and making a run in the playoffs.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

EWU is guilty of a lack of D as much as anyone and it starts at the line of scrimmage with d ends that are barely over a 200 lbs and are the size of PAC 10 safeties. So when we face big physical o lines like Montana and Weber State they try to grind it out and keep our offense off the field.

I don't think it's coincidence with Montana's success that they also typically have the best defense and best o line. Montana State, Weber and UNC have been making strides in these categories. We need to be doing the same, both from a standpoint of beating Montana and making a run in the playoffs.

True, and it's a lesson that MT learned from being in the playoffs and having to go up against teams like YSU and so forth. Another thing that is critical in that mis is to have a RB that gets the short yardage on a regular basis. The Taiwan Jones' of the world are fantastic to watch and he is a great RB but as I said to SE174 at the beginning of the season...I will take a RB like Trevyn Smith, & Chase Reynolds every day of the week that have the ability to get real close to their avg. on every play without the big, fantastic 60 yd. plus runs. I would bet he will be better at that next year because he should add a little size.

I'd rather have an athlete like TJ at the WR position if I had my druthers.

[kalm]

EWU is guilty of a lack of D as much as anyone and it starts at the line of scrimmage with d ends that are barely over a 200 lbs and are the size of PAC 10 safeties. So when we face big physical o lines like Montana and Weber State they try to grind it out and keep our offense off the field.

I don't think it's coincidence with Montana's success that they also typically have the best defense and best o line. Montana State, Weber and UNC have been making strides in these categories. We need to be doing the same, both from a standpoint of beating Montana and making a run in the playoffs.

True, and it's a lesson that MT learned from being in the playoffs and having to go up against teams like YSU and so forth. Another thing that is critical in that mis is to have a RB that gets the short yardage on a regular basis. The Taiwan Jones' of the world are fantastic to watch and he is a great RB but as I said to SE174 at the beginning of the season...I will take a RB like Trevyn Smith, & Chase Reynolds every day of the week that have the ability to get real close to their avg. on every play without the big, fantastic 60 yd. plus runs. I would bet he will be better at that next year because he should add a little size.

I'd rather have an athlete like TJ at the WR position if I had my druthers.

Or have a two headed beast like most of the NFL is doing now.

Beau Baldwin said as much in an interview this week in wanting to focus on developing depth at running back so that we have 4 solid rushers we can rotate. That being said, Taiwan had a shoulder problem from the start of the season that will probably require off-season surgery. If you watched him closely, especially late in games he would walk off the field barely able to hold his arm up. In the SFA game he was also dealing with a hip flexor injury.

As a db last year he was one of our toughest players and biggest hitters so along with getting bigger and stronger this of off season, I'd expect him next year to not shy away from mixing it up inside.

[andy7171]

Oh, and Nichols finished fourth in Payton voting. Not sure where Randolf was.

10 votes behind him in 5th.

[Grizalltheway]

Oh, and Nichols finished fourth in Payton voting. Not sure where Randolf was.

10 votes behind him in 5th.

I rest my case.

[ASUG8]

Does anyone in your conference play defense?

The Big Sky gave up an average of 41 points in their games last Saturday.

Compare that to the SoCon (14.5 ppg) and the CAA (13.5 ppg).

yes it does...


In fact, In the first round we gave up less yards then Villanova, New Hampshire, SFA, and Richmond. The Big Sky just has way more offense. EWU lost, and had more yards than App and SCSU combined. Which seems awfully out of sorts for you guys. Is that really all do to Armanti being hurt?

Take a look - EWU is just behind ASU in total offense - SCSU is #37. Both teams were busy picking each other off, and AE probably had his lowest offensive production this season vs. the Bulldogs.
http://www.ncaa.com/sports/m-footbl/sta ... fense.html