Future of FCS

[TBirdz]

I still contend that, when the moratorium is lifted, the NCAA will re-mandate FBS requirements,
and some teams will be forced to relocate to FCS, enforcement will become a thing of reality.

The candidates are obvious:
Utah State, NM State, Idaho, Kent State, Eastern Mich, Akron, half the SBC.

To me this would be the perfect solution as an FCS fan. However, how possible do you think this actually is? I understand the big 6 conferences would do anything they possibly can to prevent revenue sharing.

[dbackjon]

I still contend that, when the moratorium is lifted, the NCAA will re-mandate FBS requirements,
and some teams will be forced to relocate to FCS, enforcement will become a thing of reality.

The candidates are obvious:
Utah State, NM State, Idaho, Kent State, Eastern Mich, Akron, half the SBC.

I don't think they will go after them. The BCS teams have hard enough time filling their schedules.

[collegesportsinfo]

I still contend that, when the moratorium is lifted, the NCAA will re-mandate FBS requirements,
and some teams will be forced to relocate to FCS, enforcement will become a thing of reality.

The candidates are obvious:
Utah State, NM State, Idaho, Kent State, Eastern Mich, Akron, half the SBC.

To me this would be the perfect solution as an FCS fan. However, how possible do you think this actually is? I understand the big 6 conferences would do anything they possibly can to prevent revenue sharing.

The problem is much bigger.

It's about the NCAA not having enough control.

So say the NCAA tells those schools they need to downgrade. Then what? Do they form a new conference with no autobid and be scattered around the country? Do they force the Big Sky to expand to take some? Force the MVC to take schools?

Since conferences control their own finances and decide their own membership and NOT the NCAA, there's little the NCAA can do to avoid the lawsuits that would follow.

It's why the move that would make the most sense with the current conference independence, would be for FCs to be dropped and to force schools into 2 groups: D1 and D2. Before the stupid I-AA to FCs name change, merging DI-A and I-AA was on the table.

[JSU02]

The problem is much bigger.

It's about the NCAA not having enough control.

So say the NCAA tells those schools they need to downgrade. Then what? Do they form a new conference with no autobid and be scattered around the country? Do they force the Big Sky to expand to take some? Force the MVC to take schools?

Since conferences control their own finances and decide their own membership and NOT the NCAA, there's little the NCAA can do to avoid the lawsuits that would follow.

It's why the move that would make the most sense with the current conference independence, would be for FCs to be dropped and to force schools into 2 groups: D1 and D2. Before the stupid I-AA to FCs name change, merging DI-A and I-AA was on the table.

Those are some excellent points that I had never thought about. Lets use Eastern Michigan as an example. All the NCAA could do is tell them they have been reduced from 85 scholarships to 63. The NCAA can't force them out of the MAC, only the MAC can. EMU could still play all FBS schools if they chose, could they not? The MAC may want to keep them around for an easy win for the rest of the conference teams. I never realized what a can of worms enforcement could open.

[Fresno St. Alum]

I still contend that, when the moratorium is lifted, the NCAA will re-mandate FBS requirements,
and some teams will be forced to relocate to FCS, enforcement will become a thing of reality.

The candidates are obvious:
Utah State, NM State, Idaho, Kent State, Eastern Mich, Akron, half the SBC.

That's Likely as Marist beating Alabama in the BCS Title game. The WAC won't disband as a conf. because 2 of the 3 teams you posted suck at football and 2 of the 3 are usually good at basketball. Idaho won a bowl game last year.

[kemajic]

I still contend that, when the moratorium is lifted, the NCAA will re-mandate FBS requirements,
and some teams will be forced to relocate to FCS, enforcement will become a thing of reality.

The candidates are obvious:
Utah State, NM State, Idaho, Kent State, Eastern Mich, Akron, half the SBC.

That's Likely as Marist beating Alabama in the BCS Title game. The WAC won't disband as a conf. because 2 of the 3 teams you posted suck at football and 2 of the 3 are usually good at basketball. Idaho won a bowl game last year.

And had the same record as Fresno St.

USU and NMSU are tied for the Bball lead in the WAC.

[kemajic]

All the NCAA could do is tell them they have been reduced from 85 scholarships to 63.

I'm not sure they can even do that.

[JSU02]

They are able to team who fall below the required APR, so I would assume they could do it if a team fall below a required attendance.

[Keeper]

Trust me. Realignment (re-classification) is just a couple years away. It has been
40 years since the last major shuffle. Division I and the FBS both WILL have fewer members.
The really big $$$$ being the primary factor.

[49RFootballNow]

Trust me. Realignment (re-classification) is just a couple years away. It has been
40 years since the last major shuffle. Division I and the FBS both WILL have fewer members.
The really big $$$$ being the primary factor.

I'll bet you your favorite case of beer that not one single school in DI (BCS, FBS, FCS, Basketball only) will ever be moved from a higher division or subdivision to a lower division or subdivision against their will, EVER. I'll go even further and say that DI will have MORE members after the latest round of "discussions".

[Fresno St. Alum]

Only way there is a reshuffle up, not down is if the BCS schools say fuck off NCAA and start their own Division. leaving the NCAA hurting because you'd have the leftover WAC,CUSA,MAC,Sun Belt schools along with the FCS trying to make TV deals and money. Good luck getting on ESPN or ABC with that. The BCSers would get all the TV deals and money. Don't know that the BCS schools have the balls to leave the NCAA. They could even pay players if they did because they'd make their own rules.

[Fresno St. Alum]

Trust me. Realignment (re-classification) is just a couple years away. It has been
40 years since the last major shuffle. Division I and the FBS both WILL have fewer members.
The really big $$$$ being the primary factor.

I'll bet you your favorite case of beer that not one single school in DI (BCS, FBS, FCS, Basketball only) will ever be moved from a higher division or subdivision to a lower division or subdivision against their will, EVER. I'll go even further and say that DI will have MORE members after the latest round of "discussions".

There will be more FBS schools from FCS move up, maybe a few D-II fb playing school move ups and more non football playing move ups. With the new D-II to D-I rule I can only see about 3 D-II schools moving every 5 years instead of 5 moving every year.

[Keeper]

From NCAA news release in 2007:
quote
Division I is the holy grail for many colleges and universities that play sports, with its promise (often unmet) of high visibility and big dollars. The size of the NCAA's top competitive level has expanded significantly in recent years, and while the association has acted to toughen the criteria for membership in Division I-A -- the highest competitive level for football -- it has not done anything similar for Division I over all. It plans to do so now, said S. David Berst, a longtime NCAA staff member who is closely involved in Division I issues. He said the association would review the process for joining Division I and consider additional or tougher criteria.

"It's time to stop and at least assess that process and the impact of that growth on the membership and championship opportunities" for current members of the division," Berst said.
unquote

I know that most of you are skeptical of major reform in NCAA criteria. but it is a top priority of theirs
to reduce or redefine Division I

[49RFootballNow]

From NCAA news release in 2007:
quote
Division I is the holy grail for many colleges and universities that play sports, with its promise (often unmet) of high visibility and big dollars. The size of the NCAA's top competitive level has expanded significantly in recent years, and while the association has acted to toughen the criteria for membership in Division I-A -- the highest competitive level for football -- it has not done anything similar for Division I over all. It plans to do so now, said S. David Berst, a longtime NCAA staff member who is closely involved in Division I issues. He said the association would review the process for joining Division I and consider additional or tougher criteria.

"It's time to stop and at least assess that process and the impact of that growth on the membership and championship opportunities" for current members of the division," Berst said.
unquote

I know that most of you are skeptical of major reform in NCAA criteria. but it is a top priority of theirs
to reduce or redefine Division I

Oh sure they do, don't want to delute the money pool any more than it is now; But they will never force a school DOWN from its current division. Make it a bit tougher to move up, sure; force them out, never. The NCAA is a vouluntary organization that makes decisions by popular majority vote. Most member institutions play below Division I and will never vote for something that could hurt them.

[Keeper]

Bear in mind this is the same David Berst at the forefront of Florida State's fight with the NCAA
for football player exam cheating and vacating wins. Guess who won?
Many other schools have challenged and lost appeals over recruiting and monetary infractions.
Southern Cal is next in the cross hairs. Either the NCAA will get their way, or the BCSers theirs.
FCS will receive the benefit of crackdowns on big time college programs. Unfortunately, some
of the FBS bottom feeders could be cracked down into FCS. This isn't about democracy, but
competitive control.

[Fresno St. Alum]

From NCAA news release in 2007:
quote
Division I is the holy grail for many colleges and universities that play sports, with its promise (often unmet) of high visibility and big dollars. The size of the NCAA's top competitive level has expanded significantly in recent years, and while the association has acted to toughen the criteria for membership in Division I-A -- the highest competitive level for football -- it has not done anything similar for Division I over all. It plans to do so now, said S. David Berst, a longtime NCAA staff member who is closely involved in Division I issues. He said the association would review the process for joining Division I and consider additional or tougher criteria.

"It's time to stop and at least assess that process and the impact of that growth on the membership and championship opportunities" for current members of the division," Berst said.
unquote

I know that most of you are skeptical of major reform in NCAA criteria. but it is a top priority of theirs
to reduce or redefine Division I

The NCAA already did. No more NAIA to D-I, you must get a conf. invite, and be D-II for at least 5 years before moving to D-I, and you aren't allowed post season until after 8 years of being D-I. You know that FCS is D-I along with FBS. There were no changes done on that end. The D-Iers were tired of NJIT, Longwood, and Utah Valley coming in and mooching the NCAA tourney $$$. FCS to FBS has nothing to do with any of the bitching going on.

[collegesportsinfo]

Only way there is a reshuffle up, not down is if the BCS schools say **** off NCAA and start their own Division. leaving the NCAA hurting because you'd have the leftover WAC,CUSA,MAC,Sun Belt schools along with the FCS trying to make TV deals and money. Good luck getting on ESPN or ABC with that. The BCSers would get all the TV deals and money. Don't know that the BCS schools have the balls to leave the NCAA. They could even pay players if they did because they'd make their own rules.

It does seem that that is happening already. And I don't think it's just the BCS conferences. I think it includes some non-BCS FBS schools as well.

A split seems like it could happen. If it happens and all 6 BCS conferences have 12 teams, I think you'd find a 12 team MWC included and a 12 team CUSA (WAC, SB, MAC left out). With B10, P10, BE, MWC and CUSA expansion/replacements, it would mean 10 teams from the WAC, MAC and Sunbelt would be included (32 total available) with 22 left out.

It does seem like the only way you'd see "relegation" would be under that scenario. If San Jose St. is not invited to this Premiere College Sports Division, and they have football, then they'd need to downgrade to what is now FCS.

[Fresno St. Alum]

Bear in mind this is the same David Berst at the forefront of Florida State's fight with the NCAA
for football player exam cheating and vacating wins. Guess who won?
Many other schools have challenged and lost appeals over recruiting and monetary infractions.
Southern Cal is next in the cross hairs. Either the NCAA will get their way, or the BCSers theirs.
FCS will receive the benefit of crackdowns on big time college programs. Unfortunately, some
of the FBS bottom feeders could be cracked down into FCS. This isn't about democracy, but
competitive control.

you're dreaming. I know that UTSA, Georgia St., Texas St., Charlotte, Lamar, Jacksonville St. all want to be FBS and some of them will end up being FBS when they are ready or even if they're not. No school said they are interested in leaving for FCS. If a school like SJSU didn't want to be FBS they'd just drop football and join the Big West. If that David Berst dude were to try and force schools to drop to FCS he'd get fired by the NCAA and he and the NCAA would be sued by everyone of those schools and their conf.

[AppMan]

Are the Domino's starting to fall? Lots of chatter out there about the Big Ten and Pac 10 expansion. This was in today's USA Today.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... -schools/1

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... n-of-one/1

This from the Columbus Dispatch earlier in the week.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sp ... ml?sid=101

[Fresno St. Alum]

Only way there is a reshuffle up, not down is if the BCS schools say **** off NCAA and start their own Division. leaving the NCAA hurting because you'd have the leftover WAC,CUSA,MAC,Sun Belt schools along with the FCS trying to make TV deals and money. Good luck getting on ESPN or ABC with that. The BCSers would get all the TV deals and money. Don't know that the BCS schools have the balls to leave the NCAA. They could even pay players if they did because they'd make their own rules.

It does seem that that is happening already. And I don't think it's just the BCS conferences. I think it includes some non-BCS FBS schools as well.

A split seems like it could happen. If it happens and all 6 BCS conferences have 12 teams, I think you'd find a 12 team MWC included and a 12 team CUSA (WAC, SB, MAC left out). With B10, P10, BE, MWC and CUSA expansion/replacements, it would mean 10 teams from the WAC, MAC and Sunbelt would be included (32 total available) with 22 left out.



It does seem like the only way you'd see "relegation" would be under that scenario. If San Jose St. is not invited to this Premiere College Sports Division, and they have football, then they'd need to downgrade to what is now FCS.

Brandon, D-II board head pointed out if that were to happen(I don't think they will leave the NCAA) who says the SEC has to keep Vandy. They could replace them with W.Virginia. Its all about fb & bball w/o the NCAA. The Big Ten could get rid of Northwestern. B12 could drop Baylor. PAC 10 could drop Washington St. and add 3 schools better at sports. The MWC could drop the whole bottom half of the conf and add the top of the WAC and CUSA.

[commodore_dude]

Are the Domino's starting to fall? Lots of chatter out there about the Big Ten and Pac 10 expansion. This was in today's USA Today.

As a fan of a team in a 12-team conference, the approach just makes sense to me. A conference championship game is going to be crucial to getting a better TV deal next time around (not such a big deal for the Big Integer, which is what they will now be called courtesy of EDSBS commenters, but for the Pac 10 and Big 12 if they lose anyone for sure), and I would not be surprised if the Big East loses their AQ without expansion... the MWC definitely deserves that slot if they do go to 12. BCS money is a mighty big lure. The bottom line is there are 120 teams, 10 12-team conferences just makes sense. That of course will go out the window here in a few years with UTSA and USA for sure, and no doubt a handful of others, so if ND, Army and Navy insist on remaining independent I won't shed any tears for 'em. It's just gonna be hilarious when ND tries to renew their NBC deal and has to settle for cable because they're irrelevant and now with no possibility of joining a big conference...

[Fresno St. Alum]

someone will always take ND even if they do suck. BE would the Big 11 might go to 14 and add ND along with someone else. It would be nice if all conferences went to 12 and they if stayed at 11 you could have room for the USA's UTSA's and Charlotte's. FBS would then close off membership at 132. Unless they decided 14 or 16 per conf is better.

[AppMan]

I've always been of the opinion a 6 league division of super conferences is the key to a BCS playoff. The conference championship games are essentially the first round, with two at large berths (say a team goes 11-1 with a loss in a championship game) which gives you an 8 team playoff. Is this wave of expansion talk simply the planets beginning to come into alignment? It would seem to appear that way.

[JSU02]

I've always been of the opinion a 6 league division of super conferences is the key to a BCS playoff. The conference championship games are essentially the first round, with two at large berths (say a team goes 11-1 with a loss in a championship game) which gives you an 8 team playoff. Is this wave of expansion talk simply the planets beginning to come into alignment? It would seem to appear that way.

I also think that is where we are headed. The first rule the big boys will make is the teams selected for the play offs must come from those teams participating in conference title games. That helps them in the short term in that it will be easiest for the BCS conferences to get to 12 teams by cherry picking from the lesser conferences. Eventually there will be a trickle up effect from FCS allowing the smaller conferences to get to 12 and at that time they will expand to a 16 team playoff. This cycle will continue until we get to a 96 team football playoff.

[collegesportsinfo]

More importantly, if the Pac-10 and Big Ten expand to 12, I have a feeling the BCs might require all BCS conferences to be at 12.

As it is now, the Big Ten and Pac-10 have enough cache that the ACC, SEC and Big 12 can't force the issue. But if 5 of the 6 BCS conferences are at 12, and that means the bCS revenue is split 12 ways to each conference member, you can bet the BCS 5 will tell the Big East they need 12 members. The bCS 5 might not be so cool with the Big East schools only having to split their money 8 ways instead of 12.

The same could be said for the MWC as they are on the cusp of a BCS bid. But losing Utah to the Pac-10 and BYU to the Big 12 might hurt that plan.

Regardless, it could be a push to get the Big East to 12 and the MWC to 12. That would mean that with the Big Ten to 12 and Pac 10 to 12, that there would be 7 new BCS schools in the current BCS 6. Add 12 Mountain West schools and that number is 19.