Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

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Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by kalm »

"Ooops, it looks like they weren't cooking the books after all" says cs.com's roving environmental reporter t-man.

;)
Wednesday, Jul 7, 2010 21:01 ET
Climategate burned by reality
Climatologists exonerated, by all except the conservative media, that is
By Gene Lyons
AP/Sang Tan
The review group looking into the "Climategate" scandal at the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit.
You believe that reality is something objective, external, existing in its own right. ... But I tell you, Winston, that reality is not external. Reality exists in the human mind, and nowhere else. Not in the individual mind, which can make mistakes, only in the mind of the Party. ... Whatever the Party holds to be truth is truth. -- George Orwell, 1984


What with the Northeast sweating out a triple-digit heat wave, naive observers might expect a spate of global-warming stories in the media. You know, retreating Arctic sea ice, vanishing glaciers, etc. After all, last winter's record Washington, D.C., snowstorms triggered a veritable avalanche (sorry) of pundits and TV talking heads prating about the "elitist" idea that rising world temperatures constitute a grave threat to humanity and the natural world as we know it. No less an authority than Fox News' Sean Hannity announced that "climate change is a hoax."

Supposedly, see, there's this global cabal of scientists conspiring to bring about socialist one-world government. But what really got the ball rolling wasn't the weather, but a manufactured, media-driven scandal. The orchestrated release of more than 1,000 e-mails hacked from computers at the U.K.'s University of East Anglia's climate research center quickly became a cause célèbre.

Cherry-picked and quoted out of context, almost 20 years of informal, occasionally bitchy communications among scientists were cited as evidence of fraud. Nor were Hannity and Fox News the only ones pushing the alleged wrongdoing. CNN, NBC, CBS and ABC News, everybody joined the party. "NBC Nightly News" host Brian Williams was typical:

"Climategate they're calling it," he reported on Dec. 4, 2009. "A new scandal over global warming and it's burning up the Internet. Have the books been cooked on climate change?"

Pundits spoke glibly of "fudging the numbers," "massaging the data," and like phrases making climate researchers look as crooked as Wall Street accountants. Even that well-known philosopher of science Sarah Palin contributed a Washington Post column charging that the "e-mails reveal that leading climate 'experts' deliberately destroyed records, manipulated data to 'hide the decline' in global temperatures, and tried to silence their critics by preventing them from publishing in peer-reviewed journals."

If anything, the British press was even more censorious. But were any of these allegations true? Concerning the most widely cited example, a 1999 e-mail from professor Phil Jones to his American colleague Michael Mann of Penn State, charges of wrongdoing appeared nonsensical on their face.

"I've just completed Mike's Nature trick of adding in the real temps to each series for the last 20 years," Jones had written, "to hide the decline." But what decline? By all measures, 1998 was the warmest year in recorded history. Indeed, global-warming deniers sometimes argue erroneously that the Earth's been cooling ever since. In climatological terms, this is like saying that if April 7 is warmer than April 15, there will be no summer. In any event, 2009 now stands as the second-warmest year, and 2000 through 2009 as the warmest decade.

Writing in the Sunday Times of London, professor Andrew Watson explained: "Jones is talking about a line on a graph for the cover of a World Meteorological Organization report, published in 2000, which shows the results of different attempts to reconstruct temperature over the past 1,000 years."

Because inferential data derived from studying tree rings has diverged from thermometer temperatures since about 1960 (for reasons widely debated in scientific literature), adding "real temps" gives a more accurate picture. Nobody was being fooled. Even so, professor Jones resigned as director of East Anglia University's Climatic Research Unit pending an investigation. Last April, an official British government inquiry cleared him and his colleagues.

According to Lord Ernest Oxburgh, who led the investigation, the probe uncovered "absolutely no evidence of any impropriety whatsoever." He added that "whatever was said in the e-mails, the basic science seems to have been done fairly and properly." Then last week, a blue ribbon panel of science faculty at Penn State University unanimously exonerated professor Michael Mann himself. Investigators found "no substance" to charges made against the climatologist by his media detractors. Exactly as the embattled climatologist had said, his e-mail communications had been "misrepresented ... (and) completely twisted to imply the opposite of what was actually being said."

To date, none of the pundits or anchor-creatures who made such a fuss last winter has been heard from. One Myron Ebell, flak for the Competitive Enterprise Institute, a Washington propaganda shop funded by tobacco, oil and coal interests, denounced the result as a "whitewash." Who could have expected anything else? To an operative like Ebell, whose scientific credentials are as nonexistent as those of Hannity, Palin and Brian Williams, intellectual integrity doesn't exist.

Facts are infinitely malleable in service of ideology. People who call this "conservatism" are mistaken. It's an updated version of what Orwell feared: a dogma-driven, obscurantist attack upon reason.

Arkansas Democrat-Gazette columnist Gene Lyons is a National Magazine Award winner and co-author of "The Hunting of the President" (St. Martin's Press, 2000). You can e-mail Lyons at eugenelyons2@yahoo.com.
http://www.salon.com/news/env/environme ... limategate" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by dbackjon »

Not holding my breath for any retractions...
:thumb:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by CitadelGrad »

You won't get a retraction from me. Anthropogenic global warming is bullshit. Always has been and always will be.
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by TheDancinMonarch »

This is like being exonerated by your fellow co-conspirators.
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by GannonFan »

The problem when science gets all mixed up with politics - science invariably loses credibility, as it has in this case. Besides, when you start trying to consensus build in science you just ask for errors to be propogated.
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by travelinman67 »

AGW credo...

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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Chizzang »

I wanna play "Let's pretend"
Let's pretend for a minute that Global warming was in part effected by man...
Okay now that we've decided that is the case... what will change..?

Oh...Right - Nothing

Okay lets go back to the way we were before... oh that's right it's exactly the same as it was when we were different but only now we feel better like we did before we knew (I like feeling better)

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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by travelinman67 »

Chizzang wrote:I wanna play "Let's pretend"
Let's pretend for a minute that Global warming was in part effected by man...
Okay now that we've decided that is the case... what will change..?

Oh...Right - Nothing

Okay lets go back to the way we were before... oh that's right it's exactly the same as it was when we were different but only now we feel better

:notworthy:
If you think "nothing" has changed as a result of this AGW nonsense...

...you might wanna request a refund from Hawvawd.

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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Chizzang »

travelinman67 wrote:
Chizzang wrote:I wanna play "Let's pretend"
Let's pretend for a minute that Global warming was in part effected by man...
Okay now that we've decided that is the case... what will change..?

Oh...Right - Nothing

Okay lets go back to the way we were before... oh that's right it's exactly the same as it was when we were different but only now we feel better

:notworthy:
If you think "nothing" has changed as a result of this AGW nonsense...

...you might wanna request a refund from Hawvawd.

:coffee:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument



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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by AZGrizFan »

Chizzang wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:
If you think "nothing" has changed as a result of this AGW nonsense...

...you might wanna request a refund from Hawvawd.

:coffee:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument

:kisswink:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
b) I've replaced my washer and dryer with Energy Star appliances that use 1/3 the water and 1/3 the detergent
c) I've replaced my pool pump with a variable speed pool pump (at 3x the price, I might add), which will save several hundred dollars in electrical bills each year (thus, less energy needing to be created)
d) I keep my house at 80 in the summer and 64 in the winter (again, using less energy)
e) I've replaced my entire kitchen appliance set with appliances that use about 1/2 the energy as the old set
f) I've replaced just about every light bulb in my house with the long-lasting, enviro-friendly kind
g) I'm seriously considering convering my house to solar through mysolarcity.com, which requires no upfront purchase and a low lease payment

People WILL change, clitorus...but it's going to happen in onesies and twosies...if you're looking for some kind of "aha" moment where the entire world shifts as one, you're going to be sorely disappointed...
"Ah fuck. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Chizzang »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument

:kisswink:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
b) I've replaced my washer and dryer with Energy Star appliances that use 1/3 the water and 1/3 the detergent
c) I've replaced my pool pump with a variable speed pool pump (at 3x the price, I might add), which will save several hundred dollars in electrical bills each year (thus, less energy needing to be created)
d) I keep my house at 80 in the summer and 64 in the winter (again, using less energy)
e) I've replaced my entire kitchen appliance set with appliances that use about 1/2 the energy as the old set
f) I've replaced just about every light bulb in my house with the long-lasting, enviro-friendly kind
g) I'm seriously considering convering my house to solar through mysolarcity.com, which requires no upfront purchase and a low lease payment

People WILL change, clitorus...but it's going to happen in onesies and twosies...if you're looking for some kind of "aha" moment where the entire world shifts as one, you're going to be sorely disappointed...

I'm so proud of you AZ... :puppy:

I just had my "aha" moment - you complete me...



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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by BlueHen86 »

CitadelGrad wrote:You won't get a retraction from me. Anthropogenic global warming is bullshit. Always has been and always will be.
Well, I guess that settles it. :lol:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by BDKJMU »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument

:kisswink:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
Doesn't (corn based in the US) ethanol take more energy to produce (plant, harvest, transport to ethanol refinery, refine into ethanol) than it produces plus drive up food and feed costs all the while giving you less mpg to boot? If you're driving a Tundra you should be getting more than 14 mpg (avg city & highway). With regular unleaded I believe you would.
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by AZGrizFan »

Chizzang wrote: I'm so proud of you AZ... :puppy:

I just had my "aha" moment - you complete me...

:mrgreen:
That's a DIFFERENT kind of "aha" moment. :oops: :oops:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by AZGrizFan »

BDKJMU wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
Doesn't (corn based in the US) ethanol take more energy to produce (plant, harvest, transport to ethanol refinery, refine into ethanol) than it produces plus drive up food and feed costs all the while giving you less mpg to boot? If you're driving a Tundra you should be getting more than 14 mpg (avg city & highway). With regular unleaded I believe you would.
I wondered how long it would take somebody to bring up this argument.

When I use E-85, I get about 11 mpg. When I use regular unleaded, I get about 15. I have no idea what it takes to produce E-85.
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by kalm »

Chizzang wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:
If you think "nothing" has changed as a result of this AGW nonsense...

...you might wanna request a refund from Hawvawd.

:coffee:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument



:kisswink:
I'm reading an interesting book called "The Long Descent" by John Michael Greer. It begins with the author standing on a hilltop in Wales where he can see the ruins of every civilization that has inhabited Wales since the Celts - crumbling Roman structures, the castle of King Edward I, victorian houses from the height of the British Empire right on through to a new american style supermarket.

With one eye turned toward history, he talks about the failed assumptions of progress, perpetual growth, perpetual empire, and our ability to solve our energy problems through technology. But as the title suggests he doesn't foresee a fall off the cliff into apocalyptic chaos. A mayan girl and her family leaving her crumbling city behind in search of arable land that might better sustain a corn crop had no idea at that time that she was experiencing the fall of her civilization.

So to agree Chizzie, there might not be an "aha" moment that saves us, for most people there probably won't be an "aha" moment that we are fucked either. At least in time to do anything about it.

(But the author assures me it's really a hopeful book) :thumb:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by GannonFan »

AZGrizFan wrote:
BDKJMU wrote:
Doesn't (corn based in the US) ethanol take more energy to produce (plant, harvest, transport to ethanol refinery, refine into ethanol) than it produces plus drive up food and feed costs all the while giving you less mpg to boot? If you're driving a Tundra you should be getting more than 14 mpg (avg city & highway). With regular unleaded I believe you would.
I wondered how long it would take somebody to bring up this argument.

When I use E-85, I get about 11 mpg. When I use regular unleaded, I get about 15. I have no idea what it takes to produce E-85.
BD's right - corn based ethanol was one of the biggest boondoggle's of the climate change wave that came along in the past few years. Sure, it can replace gasoline, but the entire process of making and using it ends up emitting more greenhouse gases than it does using petroleum and oh, btw, it ends up jacking up the worldwide price of food so it threatens starvation for several million people (although, at least there, the idea was right - kill off a few million and there's a reduction in CO2 emissions).

We could use sugar-based ethanol, but that would involve importing ethanol from Brazil and we have a nice tarriff in place to protect Iowa farmers from that kind of competition. :roll:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by clenz »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
I'm making fun of the idea that Americans will miraculously "change" based on some new evidence
Regardless - the earth could be on FIRE and lava filling the seas and we wouldn't stop doing anything that we do

it's a pointless argument

:kisswink:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
b) I've replaced my washer and dryer with Energy Star appliances that use 1/3 the water and 1/3 the detergent
c) I've replaced my pool pump with a variable speed pool pump (at 3x the price, I might add), which will save several hundred dollars in electrical bills each year (thus, less energy needing to be created)
d) I keep my house at 80 in the summer and 64 in the winter (again, using less energy)
e) I've replaced my entire kitchen appliance set with appliances that use about 1/2 the energy as the old set
f) I've replaced just about every light bulb in my house with the long-lasting, enviro-friendly kind
g) I'm seriously considering convering my house to solar through mysolarcity.com, which requires no upfront purchase and a low lease payment

People WILL change, clitorus...but it's going to happen in onesies and twosies...if you're looking for some kind of "aha" moment where the entire world shifts as one, you're going to be sorely disappointed...
Did you do that because of global warming, or the long term savings that you will see because of those moves?
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by AZGrizFan »

clenz wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
I'm calling bullshit. Me, one of the biggest conks and man-caused golbal warming deniers on the planet have done the following in the past 6 months:

a) I've parked my Tundra (14 mpg) and bought a Corolla (36 mpg). And when I do drive my Tundra, I use E-85 ethanol instead of regular gas
b) I've replaced my washer and dryer with Energy Star appliances that use 1/3 the water and 1/3 the detergent
c) I've replaced my pool pump with a variable speed pool pump (at 3x the price, I might add), which will save several hundred dollars in electrical bills each year (thus, less energy needing to be created)
d) I keep my house at 80 in the summer and 64 in the winter (again, using less energy)
e) I've replaced my entire kitchen appliance set with appliances that use about 1/2 the energy as the old set
f) I've replaced just about every light bulb in my house with the long-lasting, enviro-friendly kind
g) I'm seriously considering convering my house to solar through mysolarcity.com, which requires no upfront purchase and a low lease payment

People WILL change, clitorus...but it's going to happen in onesies and twosies...if you're looking for some kind of "aha" moment where the entire world shifts as one, you're going to be sorely disappointed...
Did you do that because of global warming, or the long term savings that you will see because of those moves?
Yes. :coffee:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Chizzang »

kalm wrote:
I'm reading an interesting book called "The Long Descent" by John Michael Greer. It begins with the author standing on a hilltop in Wales where he can see the ruins of every civilization that has inhabited Wales since the Celts - crumbling Roman structures, the castle of King Edward I, victorian houses from the height of the British Empire right on through to a new american style supermarket.

With one eye turned toward history, he talks about the failed assumptions of progress, perpetual growth, perpetual empire, and our ability to solve our energy problems through technology. But as the title suggests he doesn't foresee a fall off the cliff into apocalyptic chaos. A mayan girl and her family leaving her crumbling city behind in search of arable land that might better sustain a corn crop had no idea at that time that she was experiencing the fall of her civilization.

So to agree Chizzie, there might not be an "aha" moment that saves us, for most people there probably won't be an "aha" moment that we are fucked either. At least in time to do anything about it.

(But the author assures me it's really a hopeful book) :thumb:

Two things have followed humans throughout time... since before we developed recognizable cultures or societies dating back to hunter gatherer - we're talking beyond tens of thousands of years

1) Personal Refinement
2) Environmental Decline

We move in - we establish ever increasing standards of living - we compromise our environment

Only sparse few examples of indigenous peoples in small collectives have proven to establish different relationships with their selected environments...

In every other example: It's what we do
We seek personal refinement at virtually any cost and along the way follows environmental decline - the whole process is like clockwork... now this is not a good or bad - this is just what we do - and we're exceptionally good at it - we are SMART about providing for our own


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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by AZGrizFan »

Chizzang wrote:Two things have followed humans throughout time... since before we developed recognizable cultures or societies dating back to hunter gatherer - we're talking beyond tens of thousands of years

1) Personal Refinement
2) Environmental Decline

We move in - we establish ever increasing standards of living - we compromise our environment
Only sparse few examples of indigenous peoples in small collectives have proven to establish different relationships with their selected environments...

In every other example: It's what we do
We seek personal refinement at virtually any cost and along the way follows environmental decline - the whole process is like clockwork... now this is not a good or bad - this is just what we do - and we're exceptionally good at it - we are SMART about providing for our own
:nod:
sounds like you just watched the movie "Transformers". :lol: :lol:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Chizzang »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Chizzang wrote:Two things have followed humans throughout time... since before we developed recognizable cultures or societies dating back to hunter gatherer - we're talking beyond tens of thousands of years

1) Personal Refinement
2) Environmental Decline

We move in - we establish ever increasing standards of living - we compromise our environment
Only sparse few examples of indigenous peoples in small collectives have proven to establish different relationships with their selected environments...

In every other example: It's what we do
We seek personal refinement at virtually any cost and along the way follows environmental decline - the whole process is like clockwork... now this is not a good or bad - this is just what we do - and we're exceptionally good at it - we are SMART about providing for our own
:nod:
sounds like you just watched the movie "Transformers". :lol: :lol:

:wtf: Haven't seen 'em
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by kalm »

Chizzang wrote:
kalm wrote:
I'm reading an interesting book called "The Long Descent" by John Michael Greer. It begins with the author standing on a hilltop in Wales where he can see the ruins of every civilization that has inhabited Wales since the Celts - crumbling Roman structures, the castle of King Edward I, victorian houses from the height of the British Empire right on through to a new american style supermarket.

With one eye turned toward history, he talks about the failed assumptions of progress, perpetual growth, perpetual empire, and our ability to solve our energy problems through technology. But as the title suggests he doesn't foresee a fall off the cliff into apocalyptic chaos. A mayan girl and her family leaving her crumbling city behind in search of arable land that might better sustain a corn crop had no idea at that time that she was experiencing the fall of her civilization.

So to agree Chizzie, there might not be an "aha" moment that saves us, for most people there probably won't be an "aha" moment that we are **** either. At least in time to do anything about it.

(But the author assures me it's really a hopeful book) :thumb:

Two things have followed humans throughout time... since before we developed recognizable cultures or societies dating back to hunter gatherer - we're talking beyond tens of thousands of years

1) Personal Refinement
2) Environmental Decline

We move in - we establish ever increasing standards of living - we compromise our environment

Only sparse few examples of indigenous peoples in small collectives have proven to establish different relationships with their selected environments...

In every other example: It's what we do
We seek personal refinement at virtually any cost and along the way follows environmental decline - the whole process is like clockwork... now this is not a good or bad - this is just what we do - and we're exceptionally good at it - we are SMART about providing for our own


:nod:
But this is 'marica. There's oil in them thar hills and sea floors. It can't happen here. We are exceptional.

We are not smart about providing our own, we are smart about providing for ourselves. There's a difference. And this time, the world wide population and cravings may permanently tip the balance. We may not be able to find an energy source as cheap and productive as oil.

At the end of our lives the hippies may be the most resourceful and best positioned to win. :thumb:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by travelinman67 »

kalm wrote:...At the end of our lives the hippies may be the most resourceful and best positioned to win. :thumb:
Keep thinking that way, Marmaduke.

I'll be planting genetically engineered drought and pest resistant corn...

...and fertilzing them with decomposed Hippies.

:coffee:
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Re: Rush, Hannity, Beck, T-man retract on Climategate

Post by Skjellyfetti »

travelinman67 wrote:
kalm wrote:...At the end of our lives the hippies may be the most resourceful and best positioned to win. :thumb:
Keep thinking that way, Marmaduke.

I'll be planting genetically engineered drought and pest resistant corn...

...and fertilzing them with decomposed Hippies.

:coffee:
Except your genetically engineered drought and pest resistant corn makes your morbidly obese and gives you 5 types of cancer and you die.
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