Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by Skjellyfetti »

GannonFan wrote:Whether people make the right decision and properly "rationally" weigh everything in front of them is not something that can or should be legislated and frankly wouldn't be constititional anyway.
I agree. People have a right to be ignorant if they wish. I'm just saying PUBLIC airwaves shouldn't be used for such trash... and that it SHOULD be legislated and it is constitutional, imo.

You're also right that it isn't going to happen anytime soon. Obama has said he isn't going to pursue it... and that's something I seriously disagree with him on. I'm not saying it's going to happen anytime soon... only that I believe it ought to happen.
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by GannonFan »

Skjellyfetti wrote:
GannonFan wrote:Whether people make the right decision and properly "rationally" weigh everything in front of them is not something that can or should be legislated and frankly wouldn't be constititional anyway.
I agree. People have a right to be ignorant if they wish. I'm just saying PUBLIC airwaves shouldn't be used for such trash... and that it SHOULD be legislated and it is constitutional, imo.

You're also right that it isn't going to happen anytime soon. Obama has said he isn't going to pursue it... and that's something I seriously disagree with him on. I'm not saying it's going to happen anytime soon... only that I believe it ought to happen.
It doesn't matter if Obama wanted to pursue it or not, especially without a supermajority to get it by the Senate, which he would need - it wouldn't pass Constitutional muster anymore anyway - the Court was clearly moving in that direction 25 years ago when it went away and the Court as it stands today (and probably for at least the next decade) would never go along with it. It would be one of the easiest Court decisions to predict right now.
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by Skjellyfetti »

GannonFan wrote:it wouldn't pass Constitutional muster anymore anyway - the Court was clearly moving in that direction 25 years ago when it went away and the Court as it stands today (and probably for at least the next decade) would never go along with it. It would be one of the easiest Court decisions to predict right now.
And, I disagree. You haven't really told me how it violates the Constitution. The Supreme Court has said that it doesn't violate the First Amendment... the only difference you've given me is that the media is "more complex" now. :? So, how has changed constitutionally (not in complexity) since it was last ruled on?
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by CitadelGrad »

What exactly is your objection to such speech taking place on the public airwaves? Do you want no political speech on the public airwaves or do you object only to conservative speech on the public airwaves?
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by GannonFan »

Skjellyfetti wrote:
GannonFan wrote:it wouldn't pass Constitutional muster anymore anyway - the Court was clearly moving in that direction 25 years ago when it went away and the Court as it stands today (and probably for at least the next decade) would never go along with it. It would be one of the easiest Court decisions to predict right now.
And, I disagree. You haven't really told me how it violates the Constitution. The Supreme Court has said that it doesn't violate the First Amendment... the only difference you've given me is that the media is "more complex" now. :? So, how has changed constitutionally (not in complexity) since it was last ruled on?
I have, you just choose not to listen. The Warren Court started the ball rolling even in the Red Lion case when they said that they would view any constraint of speech to be unconstititional, but then the Burger Court took it even further in the FCC v Lof W Voters when they said that they would take a lead from Congress and the FCC that technological advances would make the regulations uncessary. It's not hard to connect the dots and see where things were trending, and the last quarter of a century since then has just made it even more so. The complexity in the media and the availability of information was clearly part of the decision in the Burger Court case. There's a reason why there has been precious little movement to try to reinstate the Doctrine - the Court was clearly trending that way anyway.

The Court was always concerned with the amount of information being made available from both sides of an argument. You seem to want to argue about the quality (as you deem it to be) of it over a specific section of it. I think you're just vastly misreading what the Court did and where it was heading, and I think you're clearly in the minority of people in that opinion considering the past 25 years.
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by travelinman67 »

First, the Journolista's suggest government shut down news services that present opposing viewpoints...


Liberal journalists suggest government shut down Fox News

By Jonathan Strong
12:01 AM 07/21/2010

http://dailycaller.com/2010/07/21/liber ... -fox-news/
If you were in the presence of a man having a heart attack, how would you respond? As he clutched his chest in desperation and pain, would you call 911? Would you try to save him from dying? Of course you would.

But if that man was Rush Limbaugh, and you were Sarah Spitz, a producer for National Public Radio (update: Spitz was a producer for NPR affiliate KCRW for the show Left, Right & Center), that isn’t what you’d do at all.

In a post to the list-serv Journolist, an online meeting place for liberal journalists, Spitz wrote that she would “Laugh loudly like a maniac and watch his eyes bug out” as Limbaugh writhed in torment.

In boasting that she would gleefully watch a man die in front of her eyes, Spitz seemed to shock even herself. “I never knew I had this much hate in me,” she wrote. “But he deserves it.”

Spitz’s hatred for Limbaugh seems intemperate, even imbalanced. On Journolist, where conservatives are regarded not as opponents but as enemies, it barely raised an eyebrow.

In the summer of 2009, agitated citizens from across the country flocked to town hall meetings to berate lawmakers who had declared support for President Obama’s health care bill. For most people, the protests seemed like an exercise in participatory democracy, rowdy as some of them became.

On Journolist, the question was whether the protestors were garden-variety fascists or actual Nazis.

“You know, at the risk of violating Godwin’s law, is anyone starting to see parallels here between the teabaggers and their tactics and the rise of the Brownshirts?” asked Bloomberg’s Ryan Donmoyer. “Esp. Now that it’s getting violent? Reminds me of the Beer Hall fracases of the 1920s.”

Richard Yeselson, a researcher for an organized labor group who also writes for liberal magazines, agreed. “They want a deficit driven militarist/heterosexist/herrenvolk state,” Yeselson wrote. “This is core of the Bush/Cheney base transmorgrified into an even more explicitly racialized/anti-cosmopolitan constituency. Why? Um, because the president is a black guy named Barack Hussein Obama. But it’s all the same old nuts in the same old bins with some new labels: the gun nuts, the anti tax nuts, the religious nuts, the homophobes, the anti-feminists, the anti-abortion lunatics, the racist/confederate crackpots, the anti-immigration whackos (who feel Bush betrayed them) the pathological government haters (which subsumes some of the othercategories, like the gun nuts and the anti-tax nuts).”

“I’m not saying these guys are capital F-fascists,” added blogger Lindsay Beyerstein, “but they don’t want limited government. Their desired end looks more like a corporate state than a rugged individualist paradise. The rank and file wants a state that will reach into the intimate of citizens when it comes to sex, reproductive freedom, censorship, and rampant incarceration in the name of law and order.”

On Journolist, there was rarely such thing as an honorable political disagreement between the left and right, though there were many disagreements on the left. In the view of many who’ve posted to the list-serv, conservatives aren’t simply wrong, they are evil. And while journalists are trained never to presume motive, Journolist members tend to assume that the other side is acting out of the darkest and most dishonorable motives.


When the writer Victor Davis Hanson wrote an article about immigration for National Review, for example, blogger Ed Kilgore didn’t even bother to grapple with Hanson’s arguments. Instead Kilgore dismissed Hanson’s piece out of hand as “the kind of Old White Guy cultural reaction that is at the heart of the Tea Party Movement. It’s very close in spirit to the classic 1970s racist tome, The Camp of the Saints, where White Guys struggle to make up their minds whether to go out and murder brown people or just give up.”

The very existence of Fox News, meanwhile, sends Journolisters into paroxysms of rage. When Howell Raines charged that the network had a conservative bias, the members of Journolist discussed whether the federal government should shut the channel down.

“I am genuinely scared” of Fox, wrote Guardian columnist Daniel Davies, because it “shows you that a genuinely shameless and unethical media organisation *cannot* be controlled by any form of peer pressure or self-regulation, and nor can it be successfully cold-shouldered or ostracised. In order to have even a semblance of control, you need a tough legal framework.” Davies, a Brit, frequently argued the United States needed stricter libel laws.

“I agree,” said Michael Scherer of Time Magazine. Roger “Ailes understands that his job is to build a tribal identity, not a news organization. You can’t hurt Fox by saying it gets it wrong, if Ailes just uses the criticism to deepen the tribal identity.”

Jonathan Zasloff, a law professor at UCLA, suggested that the federal government simply yank Fox off the air. “I hate to open this can of worms,” he wrote, “but is there any reason why the FCC couldn’t simply pull their broadcasting permit once it expires?”

And so a debate ensued. Time’s Scherer, who had seemed to express support for increased regulation of Fox, suddenly appeared to have qualms: “Do you really want the political parties/white house picking which media operations are news operations and which are a less respectable hybrid of news and political advocacy?”

But Zasloff stuck to his position. “I think that they are doing that anyway; they leak to whom they want to for political purposes,” he wrote. “If this means that some White House reporters don’t get a press pass for the press secretary’s daily briefing and that this means that they actually have to, you know, do some reporting and analysis instead of repeating press releases, then I’ll take that risk.”

Scherer seemed alarmed. “So we would have press briefings in which only media organizations that are deemed by the briefer to be acceptable are invited to attend?”

John Judis, a senior editor at the New Republic, came down on Zasloff’s side, the side of censorship. “Pre-Fox,” he wrote, “I’d say Scherer’s questions made sense as a question of principle. Now it is only tactical.”
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by travelinman67 »

Then, the White House appoints one of the lead corrupt Journolista's to the committee that will select who replaces WH Correspondent Helen Thomas's seat...

...remembering...

...Fox News is the ONLY major network for which the White House won't provide a briefing room front seat.

Any bets on who gets the front seat?


Journalister who bashed Fox News is on board that determines who gets White House briefing room seat

By Caroline May
6:15 PM 07/21/2010

http://dailycaller.com/2010/07/21/journ ... room-seat/
There is currently a fierce battle among several major news outlets to claim the front-row seat in the White House briefing room recently vacated by long-time White House correspondent Helen Thomas, who retired amid scandal in June.

One of the news outlets battling for the seat is Fox News, which is currently the only TV-network without a front-row seat. It will ultimately be up to the nine-member White House Correspondents’ Association board to decide who gets the highly coveted placement.

This morning, The Daily Caller’s Jonathan Strong reported how some members of the now defunct Journolist list-serv discussed how Fox News needed to be shut down. One of the participants in the list-serv conversation was Time magazine White House correspondent Michael Scherer, who is also a member of the same White House Correspondents’ Association board that will determine which news outlet will get the vacant front-row seat in the White House briefing room.

In his missives on Journolist about Fox News, Scherer lambasted the cable news network as being an organization interested in promoting a tribal following, not one interested in the search for truth.

Fox News President Roger “Ailes understands that his job is to build a tribal identity, not a news organization,” Scherer wrote. “You can’t hurt Fox by saying it gets it wrong, if Ailes just uses the criticism to deepen the tribal identity.”

According to its website, the White House Correspondents’ Association is expected to be an impartial and inclusive body. “Consistent with the First Amendment, the White House Correspondents’ Association stands for inclusiveness in the credentialing process so that the White House remains accessible to all journalists,” its website boasts.

David Jackson, president of the White House Correspondents’ Association, declined to comment to TheDC on the implications of Scherer’s remarks with regards to the seat assignment process.

In an email statement to TheDC, a Time magazine spokesperson wrote, “Michael Scherer fully disputes The Daily Caller’s account, which selectively quotes his emails and takes his comments about the changing news landscape entirely out of context. In his emails he vocally opposes any suggestions to restrict Fox News.”

Strong reported that Scherer’s statements on the list-serv did seem “to express support for increased regulation of Fox.” As the online conversation deepened, however, Strong reported that Scherer did ultimately push back against the idea of the federal government shutting Fox News down.

“Do you really want the political parties/white house picking which media operations are news operations and which are a less respectable hybrid of news and political advocacy?” he wrote.

“The network of liberal journalists attempting to throw their weight around to shut out Fox News or any other truly major news outlet is reprehensible and undemocratic,” James Campbell, a political science professor at the State University of New York (SUNY) in Buffalo, wrote in an email statement to TheDC. “The attempt to push Fox News out of the way is wrong-headed in almost every way imaginable, from violating basic principles of free press and free speech to its antitrust implications. It also goes a long way to affirming the vast left-wing media conspiracy that many conservatives believe is out there, but had no idea was so well organized.”
...my bet on the media outlet selected...

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:ohno: ...pack of lying, corrupt POS.

Guy makes Bush/Cheney come off as saints.
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Re: Journolist : The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy

Post by CID1990 »

SK you would save a lot of time and hot air if you just said that you think speech you disagree with should not be allowed on the air, and leave it at that.

BTW- they have a pretty good fairness doctrine in broadcasting right here in Vietnam. China and Belarus, too.
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