"Ground Zero" "mosque" not really at "Ground Zero"

[GSUAlumniEagle]

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/07/ ... osque.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To be clear, Cordoba House is "in the neighborhood" of Ground Zero, and this seems to have been a deliberate choice made by its developers. But to suggest that Cordoba House is "at" Ground Zero, as some reporting and opposition groups have, is either negligent or willfully misleading.

The World Trade Center campus, shown in purple in the map below, is quite large, roughly two-tenths of a mile by two-tenths of a mile across. Eleven different streets abut or intersect it, and there are numerous points of access by foot, by cars or taxi, or on public transportation networks.

Cordoba House, shown in a red outline on the map, would be on Park Place between West Broadway and Church Street. Park Place does not intersect Ground Zero; instead, it runs parallel to it, two blocks to its north.

It is unlikely that very many people commuting to the World Trade Center site would pass by Cordoba House -- walking on that particular stretch of Park Place would not be a natural route except in unusual circumstances. Nor, does it appear to me, would Cordoba House be visible from ground level anywhere at the World Trade Center complex. The Federal Office Building across from Vesey Street on Ground Zero's northern perimeter is sixteen stories high, as is the office building between Barclay Street and Park Place; they would presumably block the view of the more diminutive Cordoba House, which although somewhat architecturally daring does not contain minarets or other spire-like features that would give it greater prominence than an ordinary, 12-story building. Like dozens and dozens of other buildings, and several other places of worship near to Ground Zero, it would be quite well concealed among Lower Manhattan's dense street grid.

Interestingly, although the Quinnipiac poll showed a majority of New York City residents opposed to the project, a 46-36 plurality of Manhattanites were in favor of it.

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http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/08/ ... osque.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There's pretty much no way that you're going to be able to see a 12-story building located two blocks behind a 16-story building that occupies the entire block, with another ~14-story building wedged in between. I also walked the entire northern permiter of the WTC site -- there's nowhere that you'd get even a passing glimpse of the mosque. And I walked the stretch of Park Place where Cordoba House would be located -- it's a fairly incoherent and downtrodden block that you'd have no particular reason to visit, unless you were going there specifically to see Cordoba House, nor is it one that you'd happen upon unintentionally. Could you see Cordoba House from a high floor on the north face of the Freedom Tower once it's built? I think that you could catch a glimpse of it -- along with most of the rest of Lower Manhattan -- if you strained yourself, although I'm not even certain about this. It certainly would not be very prominent and would look pretty much like an ordinary office building.

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[dbackjon]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

[Col Hogan]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

What? Is the government trying to ban mosques? And aren't those protesting practicing their First Amendment right to free speech???

[YoUDeeMan]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

The protesters are exercising the "freedom of speech" part of their First Amendment rights.

[AZGrizFan]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Would you want Fred Phelps to be able to build a church next door to yours and Alex's house?

[grizzaholic]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Would you want Fred Phelps to be able to build a church next door to yours and Alex's house?

[Baldy]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Christian church projects are currently and have been protested in the past all over the country, too.
Your point?

...and it has NOTHING to do with the First Amendment.

[GSUAlumniEagle]

I was kinda hoping we could actually discuss the merits of the issue. Guess I gave the population of the forum too much credit.

[AZGrizFan]

I was kinda hoping we could actually discuss the merits of the issue. Guess I gave the population of the forum too much credit.

What merits? There's only ONE reason muslims want a mosque so close to ground zero. You know it. I know it. Anyone with a brainstem knows it.

[danefan]

To me its not about the location of the mosque. To me its all about where the funding for the mosque is coming from.

I do not believe they have been able to prove the funding is coming from legitimate sources that are not connected to terrorist groups.

Build a mosque wherever you want - just don't build it with money raised in the names of WTC hijackers, which is what the question really is.

[andy7171]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Errrr, isn't freedom to assemble right there along with religion?

[dbackjon]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Would you want Fred Phelps to be able to build a church next door to yours and Alex's house?

Do you want a gravel pit next to yours?

My neighborhood is not zoned for a church, or anything non-single family residental.

[dbackjon]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

Christian church projects are currently and have been protested in the past all over the country, too.
Your point?

...and it has NOTHING to do with the First Amendment.

On zoning issues - not whether they have the right to exist at all, which is what is happening at many places.

Don't confuse neighbors protesting a ten-story church in a residental area (like the Mormons pushed through in Gilbert) with the protests that don't want any Muslim mosque, anywhere.

[AZGrizFan]

Would you want Fred Phelps to be able to build a church next door to yours and Alex's house?

Do you want a gravel pit next to yours?

My neighborhood is not zoned for a church, or anything non-single family residental.

Somehow, I don't think a gravel pit violates my "first amendment rights"....

[Gil Dobie]

Do you want a gravel pit next to yours?

My neighborhood is not zoned for a church, or anything non-single family residental.

Somehow, I don't think a gravel pit violates my "first amendment rights"....

Isn't Arizona one huge gravel pit

[AZGrizFan]

Somehow, I don't think a gravel pit violates my "first amendment rights"....

Isn't Arizona one huge gravel pit

Yes. Yes it is. And Montana is a flat wasteland. I recommend you stay away from both.

[Gil Dobie]

Isn't Arizona one huge gravel pit

Yes. Yes it is. And Montana is a flat wasteland. I recommend you stay away from both.

Gravel pits are great for off-road vehicles. Didn't say it was a bad thing, I have some good friends that live in Montana and Arizona

[CID1990]

Mosque projects are being protested all across America. So much for the First Amendment...

I stopped wondering about your slant a long time ago.

The only thing I wonder now is where your line is.

At what point would you have a problem with this?

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

Seriously, isnt there a few

Rednecks
Hicks
Gun Nuts
Right wing evangelical christians
Republican
White
Crackers
Bigots

out there that can take down a mosque like the one they want to build in NY?

Full up, during a weekend mass.......you know make things even for 9-11?

I am really losing faith in my country since the bro prez was elected.

[AZGrizFan]

Seriously, isnt there a few

Rednecks
Hicks
Gun Nuts
Right wing evangelical christians
Republican
White
Crackers
Bigots

out there that can take down a mosque like the one they want to build in NY?

Full up, during a weekend mass.......you know make things even for 9-11?

I am really losing faith in my country since the bro prez was elected.

They're in their bunkers as we speak....going over contingency plans.

[YoUDeeMan]

Seriously, isnt there a few

Rednecks
Hicks
Gun Nuts
Right wing evangelical christians
Republican
White
Crackers
Bigots

out there that can take down a mosque like the one they want to build in NY?

Full up, during a weekend mass.......you know make things even for 9-11?

I am really losing faith in my country since the bro prez was elected.

Drive a Saudi Arabian Airline jumbo jet into the mosque? Sweet irony.

Remind me not to get on your bad side.

[Appaholic]

Seriously, isnt there a few

Rednecks
Hicks
Gun Nuts
Right wing evangelical christians
Republican
White
Crackers
Bigots

out there that can take down a mosque like the one they want to build in NY?

Full up, during a weekend mass.......you know make things even for 9-11?

I am really losing faith in my country since the bro prez was elected.

Let's make it really even...say a Saudi Jumbo into the Kaaba in Mecca during the Haj.....we can always dream....