Montana Athletic Director about FCS vs FBS

[Blue Hen Fanatic]

I apologize if this has already been posted:
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Montana Athletic Director about FCS vs FBS

From: http://gohens.net/boards/viewtopic.php? ... 6b60e93758" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

By Jim O'Day, Montana AD

I understand your concerns - you are not alone. This is, perhaps, the most critical decision to ever face the intercollegiate athletic program at The University of Montana.

With state funding flat and student athletic fees holding tight, and with expenses growing year-by-year at a steady pace (at least $250,000 per year alone in just scholarship costs and related room/board costs for out student-athletes), we find ourselves at a cross roads. With revenues presently capped at about $13 million per year, we are having to find ways to cut expenses… and one option may have to be scholarships to out-of-state student athletes if we cannot find new revenue sources. We realize this could hurt our competitiveness as we cannot just take out of certain non-revenue generating sports because of Title IX issues. In addition, our insurance continues to rise, as does rent and travel. We can assume our expenses will jump at least $500,000 annually… and really no new revenue to meet these increases. We have continued to cut our expenses about $250,000 or more per year for the past three years…. But now we are down to the bare bone. Any further cuts will affect programs. You can see that already --- our entire budget for recruiting for all 14 sports is $178,000; at Montana State it’s $408,000 per the recently released NCAA audit numbers.

Currently, we charge the highest prices at the Football Championship Subdivision level for football tickets. How much more can we ask of our fans to try and keep us competitive (there are no guarantees). We generate about $4.2 million in football tickets right now…. Twice the $2.1 million brought in by Appalachian State at No. 2 amongst FCS schools. By comparison, Montana State brings in about $1.2 million per year - Washington State at $3.8 million - and Idaho at $900,000. To stay with us, MSU is making up the difference with institutional support and student athletic fees (MSU is at $144/student/year; UM is $72/student/year; the UM and MSU athletic budgets are almost identical - yet the expense lines vary because of our private funding successes). Student-athletic fees vary across the country. At James Madison, they are $1,400 per student per year. Old Dominion and Appalachian State are about $700 per student/year; while the average in the Big Sky Conference is $200/student/year. Note: Northern Arizona does not yet pay a student-athletic fee. Instead, they get the same state appropriation as Arizona and Arizona State - or about $8 million per year. On the other end of the spectrum, Sac State receives little institutional support, yet the student-athletic fee is about $265/student/year --- and generates almost $9 million for the athletics department.

Here’s an estimated breakdown of how we produce our revenues….


Football tickets $4,200,000 (MSU - $1.2 million)

Institutional support $4,500,000 (MSU - $6.7 million)

Grizzly Scholarship Association $1,500,000 (MSU - $1 million)

Student Fees $1,000,000 (MSU - $1.8 million)

Corporate/Grizzly Sports Prop. $ 650,000 (MSU - $350,00)

Men’s basketball $ 400,000 (MSU - $200,000)

Women’s basketball $ 350,000 (MSU - $50,000)

Game guarantees $ 150,000 (MSU - $800,000)

NCAA monies $ 300,000 (MSU - $300,000)

Big Sky Conference $ 125,000 (MSU - $125,000)

Television $ 75,000 (MSU - $65,000)

CLC $ 20,000 (MSU - $160,000)


Now we face the ever-mounting challenge of how to produce more revenue?


At the same time, we also have Title IX issues that Montana State does not have. UM has a 54% female population; Montana State is 54% male. We have a 40% female to male student-athlete ratio (we need to be at 54% or close - or spend 54% of our funding on female sports - neither of which is possible with football. Montana State is just the opposite as it needs a ratio of about 54% male, or 54% spending on male sports… thus, not an issue to them). We are struggling with the third and final prong for Title IX compliance, which is currently under heavier scrutiny based on recent Obama Administration interpretation. We will most likely need to add two female sports shortly or face possibly penalty. Those penalties do not affect the athletic programs - but schools in general as their federal funds/grants/research dollars can be impacted - or about $150 million annually at UM that could be at risk. Thus, somehow, we need to find about $2 million more per year (not counting facilities) to run two new programs. Thus, we most likely will need higher student fees to meet these Title IX and related expenses. Doubt it any of this money would help any other concerns (maintaining football funding, facility improvements, etc.). Also, additional institutional support is out of the question…. It is so tight right now.


Looking at our present revenue structure, one way to increase funding is to consider a move to the Football Bowl Subdivision (NCAA revenues, game guarantees, television, conference dollars and corporate dollars are significantly higher. For example, Idaho receives almost $2.5 million in league revenues, and another $500,000 in television revenues) - but this is not a “for sure” situation either. Instead, it might be considered a gamble - maybe not necessarily a risk. Could we lose fans in the stands? Absolutely. Could we right now if we went 6-5 or less? Absolutely. Would fans continue to come if we charge high prices for Western States of Colorado, or maybe even Montana Tech? Who knows. Will they come if our schedule consists of Idaho, Utah State, Hawaii, San Jose State… and non-conference games against schools such as Boise State, Nevada, Wyoming and Washington State? Possibly. Note: Wyoming is hosting Nebraska next year. In exchange, they will travel to Nebraska in 2012 and 2013. In 2013, Nebraska will pay Wyoming $1 million for making the trip. Last year, Wyoming hosted Texas as part of a home-and-home contract. Those are not available to us now. In fact, WAC or Mountain West schools are no longer allowed to play at FCS schools via by-law changes. They also are recommending they don’t play ANY FCS school - home or away. That begs the question: Who do Montana fans want to see in the next 2-10 years in Washington-Grizzly Stadium. At the FCS level, there are fewer and fewer out there who will come here.


Couple other things to realize:


--- Both the Big Sky Conference and the WAC NEED Montana. Where ever we end, that conference will most likely survive at a higher level. The commissioners of both conferences know that, as do the schools (although some at the Big Sky level would hate to admit it).


--- Montana is THE school west of the Mississippi in the FCS - and the only one since Boise in 1994 to make the championship game (which the Broncos lost). The Big Sky losing Montana would be devastating to some as they need the traveling Montana fans to attend their contests, and purchase tickets. We are also responsible for the television dollars associated with each of the league schools. For example, KPAX/MTN bid $100,000 to television the Griz-Cat game, the next highest bidder was Max Media at $20,000. Our other games were bid at $10,000 each by KPAX; Max Media pays $2,500 to do Bobcat telecasts. Thus, Max Media is spending more money in production equipment; while the schools are getting the cash from KPAX. By league policy, 60% of the revenue from these telecasts go to the HOME team (not UM), 35% to the visitor and 5% to the league. So how out-of-line is this: Last year, MSU received $60,000 of KPAX’s bid (to do UM games), while Montana received $35,000 and the conference $5,000. These are the reasons why Boise State left the Big Sky in the mid-1990s; why BYU and Texas are doing what they’re doing right now. They want to control their television money. The television money should be following UM, but we get outvoted on this 8-1 whenever it comes up.


--- Football at UM breaks even. We generate $6.5 in revenues; and the expenses associated with football at $6.5. Thus, others are probably losing $3-$4.5 million annually. How long can that continue at some schools?


--- We are struggling to find opponents to play in Missoula…. Cost is high, plus we win 93% of our games here. People do not like to come here. Even Division II schools are asking “guarantees” in excess of $125,000 to come here. That cuts drastically into our revenues.


--- We are NOT guaranteed home playoff games. We have been extremely fortunate in the past. To put in perspective, we made about $100,000 for the three home playoff games last year - and sent another $1.1 million to the NCAA. A regular season home game nets between $400,000 and $1 million (Montana State, App State, etc.). Being in the WAC, we are allowed 12 games instead of 11 - and 13 when you play at Hawaii. So instead of $100,000 at max, we would be seeing additional dollars… at a minimum of $300,000.


--- The FCS playoff system is hurting financially. We produced $1.1 million of last year’s budget of $2.5 million. The other 11 games produced less than $1 million TOTAL. The NCAA lost almost $500,000 again, and it will not continue to tolerate to follow this plan. Now we’ve added another round and four more teams…. Being on the committee, and as chair, I know this is a major concern to the NCAA - and a last-gasp reason for changing to Frisco, Texas, in hopes of attracting more attention and support. It won’t help to move the championship back three weeks into January - let alone that it will be taking place 40 minutes away from the Cotton Bowl, which has also been moved to that night. So much for FCS exposure on national television. Just to keep the student-athletes on campus during Christmas will also cost the two schools in the championship an additional $100,000 - none of which is budgeted. And to put in perspective, we LOST $150,000 each of the past two year going to the championship game. Had we won, the incentives for coaches would have put the losses over $200,000 each time. We get no additional revenue for any of this.


--- AND OF UTMOST IMPORTANCE: We are NOT considering the health and welfare of the student-athletes, who are having to spend at least one month of playing 4-5 more games --- which is permanently damaging their bodies - and hurting their academics. This is not fair to them - nor their coaches. This is where all of us are selfish, and want the playoff system vs. a bowl. At the FBS level, there is a month off to recover bodies, take care of academics and finals, and at the end, a reward of a bowl and some fun --- and the schools don’t lose money like we do at the FCS level.


History will determine if the decision by the new President (Royce Engstrom) to either remain where we are, or take a new direction, was correct. There are no easy answers. Heck, had we gone to the WAC a few years ago, we’d probably be in a much more lucrative Mountain West Conference right now with schools we consider on academic par - Wyoming, Colorado State, etc. Who knows what will happen. I would venture to say there are only about four conferences right now who appear to be solid and control their own destiny --- the SEC, the Big 10, the Big 12 (unless Texas and Oklahoma do an “about face” in the next few years) and the Pac 12 Even the ACC and the Big East have issues, let alone those like Conference USA. The Mountain West is starting to look more like the old WAC (especially if TCU bolts, which is likely). Could that mean a merger of the Mountain West and WAC down the road…. Again. This could be a distinct possibility. That being said, where does that leave the Big Sky? Should the FCS fail - which is another possibility, especially with Appalachian State, James Madison, Villanova, Delaware, Georgia Southern, Richmond and others being considered for moves into other conference alliances within FBS conferences - would we be all alone? How many schools in the Big Sky would still be offering football, or would we become a basketball conference? Would it even be Division I, or would we be forced out to Division II? If you don’t have an invitation from a Division I conference, you may have no choice. This may be the only opportunity UM gets to be “invited” to a true Division I conference.


As you can see, there are no easy answers - and it is very, very complicated. These points and many others will be presented --- and have been closely reviewed and monitored by our national consultants --- who do these independent studies for schools for a living. Other responsible schools are doing the same, as are conferences. They give you the most accurate, up-to-date information available.


Finally, I will end this long message with an interesting observation by the consultants.


In asking faculty and deans who are their “peers,” they mentioned schools such as Idaho, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Nevada, Wyoming, Colorado and Colorado State. The consultants asked why no Big Sky schools - with the exception of Montana State for “tied in” reasons,” the faculty responded they do not see the Idaho States, Eastern Washingtons, Northern Colorados, etc., as “peer academic institutions.” Au contraire, the consultants’ studies show: “You are who you hang out with.” This is true across the board in life --- and here as well. Thus, this is extremely important to consider as well as we move forward.


Right now, we have a heavy saturation of Montana students attending UM (1,500 more Montana residents now attend UM than MSU - hard to believe… a complete turn-around from 10-15 years ago). But, census reports show the numbers of Montana high school graduates spiraling downward rapidly. Each Montana student costs UM about $2,300… a loss-leader for us in the business world. Thus, they need higher tuition being paid by out-of-state students to make up the difference. That out-of-state market is becoming increasingly competitive… and national exposure from an athletic program can help open the door to those out-of-state students who might consider coming here. This, too, has to be considered in any decision making…. A vision for future enrollment.


I have a motto: “Don’t make decisions based on ego or emotion. Base them on fact and figures.” That will be no different here. Right now, our emotions are high… we want what we had… We like being at the top and play for championships bigger than the Big Sky Conference - but we have to define “at the top of what?” We have great regional/state-wide recognition, but not much nationally. Look at the direction Boise State is taking. The consultants believe Montana could be the next Boise State - not the next Idaho. Actually, Idaho may now be in a better financial situation than we do - and their college is growing nationally.


Today is a new day. It is NOT business as usual - particularly in the area of intercollegiate athletics at the NCAA Division I level… where budgets range from $8 million annually to Texas and Ohio State at $120 million.


I’m sure you see now why this will be such a difficult decision by President Engstrom - and one that will have to be made in the very near future. We will feed him all the latest information, but ultimately, it will be his decision --- and will have to be supported by the Board of Regents. Wish it were easier, but it isn’t. At least UM has options --- others are only followers in all of these discussions. We’re in a good place… and that separates us both academically and athletically from the others.

Keep the faith …. And GO GRIZ!!!!

Jim O'Day
Director of Athletics
The University of Montana
Phone: 406.243.5348

[Silenoz]

It's in the move-up thread about TxSt and UTSA, no harm done though!

[JBB]

Those are compelling reasons to move. The two most important to me are the financial circumstances surrounding the FCS playoffs and the extra games the playoffs demand.

It sounds to me the money is better for Montana in the FBS.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Those are compelling reasons to move. The two most important to me are the financial circumstances surrounding the FCS playoffs and the extra games the playoffs demand.

It sounds to me the money is better for Montana in the FBS.

Not gonna rehash the bs in the letter. He wants it to appear like it's the only option so he does that. If you want to look at the reasons that it has some real fluff in it then go check the other thread here and also give a gander at the one on AGS because they provide some good insight.

And the fact that O'Day is now poo poo'ing the playoffs as a problem is fucking hysterical. I had never thought of him as a guy that was disingenuous but after seeing this letter a few days ago I now view him as a fella that talks out of both sides of his mouth and if a day comes when he needs to go I'll be all for it.

[Cap'n Cat]

Not a pretty picture painted about college athletics and football, especially. Lots of us here could learn something about the workings of our athletic departments here and the challeges they face.

[JBB]

His points are completely objective.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

His points are completely objective.

of course.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Not a pretty picture painted about college athletics and football, especially. Lots of us here could learn something about the workings of our athletic departments here and the challeges they face.

Agree with that. It sheds a lot of light.

[DJH]

Those are compelling reasons to move. The two most important to me are the financial circumstances surrounding the FCS playoffs and the extra games the playoffs demand.

It sounds to me the money is better for Montana in the FBS.

And the fact that O'Day is now poo poo'ing the playoffs as a problem is fucking hysterical. I had never thought of him as a guy that was disingenuous but after seeing this letter a few days ago I now view him as a fella that talks out of both sides of his mouth and if a day comes when he needs to go I'll be all for it.

Yesterday I got the impression that you agreed with him in this regard? Do you agree now that it is BS?

[clenz]

And the fact that O'Day is now poo poo'ing the playoffs as a problem is fucking hysterical. I had never thought of him as a guy that was disingenuous but after seeing this letter a few days ago I now view him as a fella that talks out of both sides of his mouth and if a day comes when he needs to go I'll be all for it.

Yesterday I got the impression that you agreed with him in this regard? Do you agree now that it is BS?

That may be one of the poorest written letters I've laid my eyes upon in my entire life. The man is the AD of a D1 school, I expected better from him.


When I read his letter I thought I was reading a letter written by a mix of this guy

[youtube][/youtube]



and this guy

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

And the fact that O'Day is now poo poo'ing the playoffs as a problem is fucking hysterical. I had never thought of him as a guy that was disingenuous but after seeing this letter a few days ago I now view him as a fella that talks out of both sides of his mouth and if a day comes when he needs to go I'll be all for it.

Yesterday I got the impression that you agreed with him in this regard? Do you agree now that it is BS?

Some things he says I don't disagree with. But there is a lot he doesn't say, there is a lot he stretches to make look like FBS is better and so forth. I don't know which part you are talking about exactly but overall I think there is some BS in this as I have felt all along.

I most assuredly think that he slants his letter in favor of FBS here.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Yesterday I got the impression that you agreed with him in this regard? Do you agree now that it is BS?

That may be one of the poorest written letters I've laid my eyes upon in my entire life. The man is the AD of a D1 school, I expected better from him.


When I read his letter I thought I was reading a letter written by a mix of this guy

[youtube][/youtube]



and this guy

That was actually an email reply I think clenz so that should be taken into account. If you wanted to hold email responses and board posts to the standard you would to more formal type stuff then we'd all have to look at ourselves pretty poorly.

[clenz]

That was actually an email reply I think clenz so that should be taken into account. If you wanted to hold email responses and board posts to the standard you would to more formal type stuff then we'd all have to look at ourselves pretty poorly.

Even if it was an e-mail, I don't care. The man is the athletic director of a D1 school. He should get his facts straight, there are a couple factual errors in there and a BIG one while trying to prove his point about the FCS west of the Mississippi, he should be able to use proper grammar and structure as well...even if it was an e-mail reply.

The writing on a message board is one thing, but sending an e-mail like that out representing the entire University of Montana is embarrassing for him, the athletic department, the teams, students, and alumni.


Anything I send from my work email that deals with work is proof read many times over and run through grammatical checks a couple times. That e-mail not only represents me, it represents my company.


If I make an ass out of myself here, that is one that as I'm only representing myself.


I'm sure you'll disagree and we will have to agree to disagree here, but that is my thought on it when he is representing something like that.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

That was actually an email reply I think clenz so that should be taken into account. If you wanted to hold email responses and board posts to the standard you would to more formal type stuff then we'd all have to look at ourselves pretty poorly.

Even if it was an e-mail, I don't care. The man is the athletic director of a D1 school. He should get his facts straight, there are a couple factual errors in there and a BIG one while trying to prove his point about the FCS west of the Mississippi, he should be able to use proper grammar and structure as well...even if it was an e-mail reply.

The writing on a message board is one thing, but sending an e-mail like that out representing the entire University of Montana is embarrassing for him, the athletic department, the teams, students, and alumni.


Anything I send from my work email that deals with work is proof read many times over and run through grammatical checks a couple times. That e-mail not only represents me, it represents my company.


If I make an ass out of myself here, that is one that as I'm only representing myself.


I'm sure you'll disagree and we will have to agree to disagree here, but that is my thought on it when he is representing something like that.

I ain't disagreeing it should have been given a little more brush up but I ain't gonna put a shit load of worth on that as it may have been an email to someone he knows or has met. The tone of the letter seems like it may have been to a friend type and thus those kinds of measures that one would usually take as far as appearance get shoveled aside. Like if I were sending you an email I would not worry about it as much as if I were sending a customer something.

I think his degree was Journalism and if this were something he thought was gonna hit the mainstream I think it would have been cleaned up and I don't think he would have said some of the silly BS he said. That's why I think this was to someone he had met or kinda knew at least. I could be wrong on that, just a feeling I get.

[DBlue]

...The man is the athletic director of a D1 school. He should get his facts straight, there are a couple factual errors in there and a BIG one while trying to prove his point about the FCS west of the Mississippi, he should be able to use proper grammar and structure as well...
....sending an e-mail like that out representing the entire University of Montana is embarrassing for him, the athletic department, the teams, students, and alumni.....
Anything I send from my work email that deals with work is proof read many times over and run through grammatical checks a couple times. That e-mail not only represents me, it represents my company.

Clenz, you are 100% correct. Mr. O'Day is either ignorant or lazy. Griz fans, you must know the guy. What is he, ignorant or lazy?

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

...The man is the athletic director of a D1 school. He should get his facts straight, there are a couple factual errors in there and a BIG one while trying to prove his point about the FCS west of the Mississippi, he should be able to use proper grammar and structure as well...
....sending an e-mail like that out representing the entire University of Montana is embarrassing for him, the athletic department, the teams, students, and alumni.....
Anything I send from my work email that deals with work is proof read many times over and run through grammatical checks a couple times. That e-mail not only represents me, it represents my company.

Clenz, you are 100% correct. Mr. O'Day is either ignorant or lazy. Griz fans, you must know the guy. What is he, ignorant or lazy?

Who gives a fuck? An email may not be the best gauge of your either/or question so just pick one.

[∞∞∞]

I wonder if he knew the email would end up on GrizNation and purposefully painted a bad picture to sway the opinion of fans that didn't want to move up. Seems kinda extreme but not out of the realm of possibility. And let's remember that when an AD says something, it doesn't mean we should completely take his/her word for it. Is he a professional in his field? Absolutely. But many professionals out there make mistakes and some have no idea what they're actually doing (see UNCW's Kelly Mehrtens)...they're humans too after all.

[Big McLargehuge]

An email reply just because you're (insert powerful position here) is still an email reply. Mr. O'Day made it clear that he didn't want the message getting posted around (or maybe he did and just put that there to cover his tail...I wouldn't be surprised of that) and it did. Is it perfect? No. Is it biased to what he would like to happen? Almost certainly. Is it completely right? No. Is it completely wrong? No.

I've been on the fence on the issue from Day 1. I have a very interesting situation in my family as my brother-in-law is a Marshall alumni...I don't need to go into the history between our two schools, but I also am very familiar with the success Marshall had in the FBS, but only when it was still referred to as D1-A. Now they're a cellar dweller and most Saturdays he ends up extremely disappointed, but he's still intensely loyal to his team. I see Marshall's initial success...6 bowl games in their first 7 years in D1-A/FBS, 5 MAC Championships, etc. and I think most of us as fans of teams in this situation strive for that. Then you look at Marshall the past 5 years and are stopped in your tracks...what the hell happened there? One bad coaching hire and a questionable (at best) conference change and now they're an irrelevant program. When you're a mid-major you have to have sustained success to stay at that top level, and that's a very hard thing to do. Marshall did it for a good while, but their AD made a few awful decisions. With those awful decisions then Boise State becomes the poster child...but they have something that most mid-majors don't really have the luxury of...a centralized location in an area that is great for students who are from Pac-10 regions but aren't considered good enough to get into places like USC and Oregon. Its going to be hard for anybody to replicate that, and completely impossible for anyone to replicate that on the east coast with everything so close together.

I have no idea what the future would hold for Montana if we move up. I'm very confident in our ability to hold our own in the first few years, especially if it would be in a weakened WAC. But does that success become a regularity, or would we lose our 'charm' or whatever you want to call it? I'm confident we'd be a million times more successful than Idaho (not saying anything), but unlikely to be as successful as Boise State (even throwing this year out the window its highly unlikely)...but that's just to say we'll be somewhere between a perennial BCS Bowl contender and a school that is coming off a decade where they won less than 3 games per season on average. Not really saying anything there...


But I, personally, look at this decision mostly as a football decision. As a football decision I am very much on the fence about moving up and not moving up...honestly I couldn't care less about the ramifications for the other sports because I don't really care about any of the other sports, and I won't until UM starts icing a hockey team...which will happen 3 days after the Florida Panthers win the Stanley Cup. But the finances are an angle that most of us are in the dark with. I have no doubt that Mr. O'Day's email is biased towards his personal feelings, but if those numbers are correct then I may well start leaning towards the move up.

[DBlue]

Who gives a fuck? An email may not be the best gauge of your either/or question so just pick one.

I choose lazy...I hope I'm correct.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Who gives a fuck? An email may not be the best gauge of your either/or question so just pick one.

I choose lazy...I hope I'm correct.

You may be.

[EWURanger]

So many embellishments and half-truths in this letter.

My favorite bit was where he talked about how the play-off system isn't "fair" to student-athletes because it puts the additional strain of playing 4-5 more games a year on them. Hmmmmm. I thought they were on the football team to play football. How laughable.

[BigSkyBears]

On a side note, UM AD JIm O'Day was a finalist for the UNC AD job about 6 years ago and was passed over for our current AD Jay Hinrichs.

[Grizalltheway]

...The man is the athletic director of a D1 school. He should get his facts straight, there are a couple factual errors in there and a BIG one while trying to prove his point about the FCS west of the Mississippi, he should be able to use proper grammar and structure as well...
....sending an e-mail like that out representing the entire University of Montana is embarrassing for him, the athletic department, the teams, students, and alumni.....
Anything I send from my work email that deals with work is proof read many times over and run through grammatical checks a couple times. That e-mail not only represents me, it represents my company.

Clenz, you are 100% correct. Mr. O'Day is either ignorant or lazy. Griz fans, you must know the guy. What is he, ignorant or lazy?

Who cares? Clenz, a.k.a. Mr. "I've saw" is the last person who should be nitpicking about grammar mistakes.

[Silenoz]

I wonder if he knew the email would end up on GrizNation and purposefully painted a bad picture to sway the opinion of fans that didn't want to move up. Seems kinda extreme but not out of the realm of possibility. And let's remember that when an AD says something, it doesn't mean we should completely take his/her word for it. Is he a professional in his field? Absolutely. But many professionals out there make mistakes and some have no idea what they're actually doing (see UNCW's Kelly Mehrtens)...they're humans too after all.

Supposedly there was a message sent out to keep it private, but it leaked to BobcatNation almost instantly. Take that for what it's worth

[Keeper]

+


=


a deal