Buchanan nails it- why should China do anything we ask?

[CID1990]

Good read from Pat Buchanan this week.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=41310#" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Chinese do seem to be behaving a lot like the US of the 19th century, as well they should. What benefits China should be pursued. As long as we stay obsessed with their human rights record (yes yes, we killed Indians and put slaves in the fields) and continue to vilify those our own who derive wealth from industry while handcuffing those same industries with overly protective labor regulations we will continue to decline. China will continue to eat our lunch.

This will surely start a tit for tat over whose fault this is, but the reality is that China is doing it right, economically and strategically speaking.

[YoUDeeMan]

Well done article.

[houndawg]

The Robber Barons were putting America first. Ol' Suckerpunch is entertaining, gotta give him that.


Empires come and empires go, and we're at a place in history where we can see both happening.

[dbackjon]

So the US should ignore the environment, human rights etc?


Buchanan is screwed in the head.


What we need is to stop importing goods from them, and bring manufacturing back to the US. Yeah, the robber barons of Wall Street may make a few less bucks, but everyone else wins.

[houndawg]

So the US should ignore the environment, human rights etc?


Buchanan is screwed in the head.


What we need is to stop importing goods from them, and bring manufacturing back to the US. Yeah, the robber barons of Wall Street may make a few less bucks, but everyone else wins.

We all need to disabuse ourselves of this notion that manufacturing jobs are coming back. It ain't gonna happen.

[Baldy]

The Robber Barons were putting America first. Ol' Suckerpunch is entertaining, gotta give him that.


Empires come and empires go, and we're at a place in history where we can see both happening.

You just made my day, dawg.
I can't believe you believe in myths like unicorns and "robber barons". Lemme guess, Santa came to your house last month, too.

[houndawg]

The Robber Barons were putting America first. Ol' Suckerpunch is entertaining, gotta give him that.


Empires come and empires go, and we're at a place in history where we can see both happening.

You just made my day, dawg.
I can't believe you believe in myths like unicorns and "robber barons". Lemme guess, Santa came to your house last month, too.

Glad to make your day, Baldy! It made mine to hear that Morgan, Getty, Rockerfeller, et al, were thinking of America first.

[houndawg]

Good read from Pat Buchanan this week.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=41310#" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Chinese do seem to be behaving a lot like the US of the 19th century, as well they should. What benefits China should be pursued. As long as we stay obsessed with their human rights record (yes yes, we killed Indians and put slaves in the fields) and continue to vilify those our own who derive wealth from industry while handcuffing those same industries with overly protective labor regulations we will continue to decline. China will continue to eat our lunch.

This will surely start a tit for tat over whose fault this is, but the reality is that China is doing it right, economically and strategically speaking.

The simple fact is that no American worker, union or not, can survive on Chinese wages.

China will continue to eat our lunch, regardless, and our so-called "leaders" will continue spewing the Big Lie that the fault lies with American labor.

How about our vaunted management try living on what the Chinese pay their managers?

[kalm]

Good read from Pat Buchanan this week.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=41310#" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Chinese do seem to be behaving a lot like the US of the 19th century, as well they should. What benefits China should be pursued. As long as we stay obsessed with their human rights record (yes yes, we killed Indians and put slaves in the fields) and continue to vilify those our own who derive wealth from industry while handcuffing those same industries with overly protective labor regulations we will continue to decline. China will continue to eat our lunch.

This will surely start a tit for tat over whose fault this is, but the reality is that China is doing it right, economically and strategically speaking.

The simple fact is that no American worker, union or not, can survive on Chinese wages.

China will continue to eat our lunch, regardless, and our so-called "leaders" will continue spewing the Big Lie that the fault lies with American labor.

How about our vaunted management try living on what the Chinese pay their managers?

Houndawg is nailing it. Why do our leaders, from both parties, support the current trade policies to the detriment of the american working class? Luckily technology, social safety nets, and the entertainment industry have kept the humble masses comfortable and forgiving of the multinationals for destroying our wealth. It's a beautiful racket.

Btw, good article. Nixon was clearly a brilliant president surrounded by perhaps the brightest set of minds the whitehouse has ever seen. Alex P. Keaton was right.

[Baldy]

You just made my day, dawg.
I can't believe you believe in myths like unicorns and "robber barons". Lemme guess, Santa came to your house last month, too.

Glad to make your day, Baldy! It made mine to hear that Morgan, Getty, Rockerfeller, et al, were thinking of America first.

Yeah, all American business should put "America first".

When was the last time YOU put America first in any of your business or personal dealings?

[youngterrier]

So the US should ignore the environment, human rights etc?


Buchanan is screwed in the head.


What we need is to stop importing goods from them, and bring manufacturing back to the US. Yeah, the robber barons of Wall Street may make a few less bucks, but everyone else wins.

and how do you propose we do that? because the people who make a few less bucks in this situation as you say, are the ones in charge of making it happen. therefore it won't happen, not without the government passing legislation that will harm those of us who don't manufacture

[kalm]

So the US should ignore the environment, human rights etc?


Buchanan is screwed in the head.


What we need is to stop importing goods from them, and bring manufacturing back to the US. Yeah, the robber barons of Wall Street may make a few less bucks, but everyone else wins.

and how do you propose we do that? because the people who make a few less bucks in this situation as you say, are the ones in charge of making it happen. therefore it won't happen, not without the government passing legislation that will harm those of us who don't manufacture

huh?

[youngterrier]

and how do you propose we do that? because the people who make a few less bucks in this situation as you say, are the ones in charge of making it happen. therefore it won't happen, not without the government passing legislation that will harm those of us who don't manufacture

huh?

the only way manufacturing comes back in this country is if the government passes high enough tariffs to where business is forced to buy American because it's cheaper. If that happens the only "winners" are the bums we get to work manufacturing jobs

[kalm]

Glad to make your day, Baldy! It made mine to hear that Morgan, Getty, Rockerfeller, et al, were thinking of America first.

Yeah, all American business should put "America first".

When was the last time YOU put America first in any of your business or personal dealings?

Well I can't speak for houndawg, but I once stopped by the local farmers market.

(I noticed while loading groceries into my SUV in the Walmart parking lot that I had forgot to pick up tomatoes.)

[kalm]

[/size]

huh?

the only way manufacturing comes back in this country is if the government passes high enough tariffs to where business is forced to buy American because it's cheaper. If that happens the only "winners" are the bums we get to work manufacturing jobs

If manufacturing were to come back, there would be more manufacturing jobs, better pay, and an increase in demand.

[youngterrier]

the only way manufacturing comes back in this country is if the government passes high enough tariffs to where business is forced to buy American because it's cheaper. If that happens the only "winners" are the bums we get to work manufacturing jobs

If manufacturing were to come back, there would be more 1)manufacturing jobs, 2)better pay, and an 3) increase in demand.

1) how so? the jobs would cost companies more money
2) better pay for the people with the jobs in relation to the pay in china maybe but it would hurt the rest of us who have to pay higher prices for goods
3) Based on what? the fact that there is no competition?

protectionism fails, free trade works. it's a basic concept of economics

[kalm]

If manufacturing were to come back, there would be more 1)manufacturing jobs, 2)better pay, and an 3) increase in demand.

1) how so? the jobs would cost companies more money
2) better pay for the people with the jobs in relation to the pay in china maybe but it would hurt the rest of us who have to pay higher prices for goods
3) Based on what? the fact that there is no competition?

protectionism fails, free trade works. it's a basic concept of economics

Tell that to the Chinese who don't really need anything from us other than raw materials and our markets. Free trade benefits multinational corporations and immerging industrialized countries with populations as yet unaware enough to rise up and say "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?"

"Free trade" is like "free" market capitalism. Nice in theory. Why do you hate Adam Smith?

[youngterrier]

1) how so? the jobs would cost companies more money
2) better pay for the people with the jobs in relation to the pay in china maybe but it would hurt the rest of us who have to pay higher prices for goods
3) Based on what? the fact that there is no competition?

protectionism fails, free trade works. it's a basic concept of economics

Tell that to the Chinese who don't really need anything from us other than raw materials and our markets. Free trade benefits multinational corporations and immerging industrialized countries with populations as yet unaware enough to rise up and say "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?"

"Free trade" is like "free" market capitalism. Nice in theory. Why do you hate Adam Smith?

wow. there is so much failure in that post I don't know which concept to address first. As long as we have people who rise up with their entitlement complexes and ask "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?" we will not have manufacturing jobs in America. Minimum wage will continue to increase and corporations will continue to send jobs overseas because it is cheaper. Free Trade benefits us all, we pay cheaper prices for products that are most of the time of the same quality of American made products. We save money and are therefore able to use that money to invest in other things, leading to us all benefiting. Why do I have to give you a basic economics lesson?

[houndawg]

Glad to make your day, Baldy! It made mine to hear that Morgan, Getty, Rockerfeller, et al, were thinking of America first.

Yeah, all American business should put "America first".

When was the last time YOU put America first in any of your business or personal dealings?

Sounds like you find Buchanan as funny as I do.

[kalm]

Tell that to the Chinese who don't really need anything from us other than raw materials and our markets. Free trade benefits multinational corporations and immerging industrialized countries with populations as yet unaware enough to rise up and say "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?"

"Free trade" is like "free" market capitalism. Nice in theory. Why do you hate Adam Smith?

wow. there is so much failure in that post I don't know which concept to address first. As long as we have people who rise up with their entitlement complexes and ask "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?" we will not have manufacturing jobs in America. Minimum wage will continue to increase and corporations will continue to send jobs overseas because it is cheaper. Free Trade benefits us all, we pay cheaper prices for products that are most of the time of the same quality of American made products. We save money and are therefore able to use that money to invest in other things, leading to us all benefiting. Why do I have to give you a basic economics lesson?

There is nothing basic about the concept of free trade. It's a complicated issue and you trying to dismiss it as otherwise shows your ignorance a little.

U.S. wages have been stagnant for 30 years and the wealth we collectively had in the form of natural resources and production is being transfered upward and accross the Pacific. So yes, we now need those cheaper goods because our exchange based economy isn't able to support our standard of living.

[BDKJMU]

Tell that to the Chinese who don't really need anything from us other than raw materials and our markets. Free trade benefits multinational corporations and immerging industrialized countries with populations as yet unaware enough to rise up and say "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?"

"Free trade" is like "free" market capitalism. Nice in theory. Why do you hate Adam Smith?

wow. there is so much failure in that post I don't know which concept to address first. As long as we have people who rise up with their entitlement complexes and ask "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?" we will not have manufacturing jobs in America. Minimum wage will continue to increase and corporations will continue to send jobs overseas because it is cheaper. Free Trade benefits us all, we pay cheaper prices for products that are most of the time of the same quality of American made products. We save money and are therefore able to use that money to invest in other things, leading to us all benefiting. Why do I have to give you a basic economics lesson?

Terrier pretty much nailed it. If you all of a sudden got everything in US stores that made China replaced with made in the US, you'd be paying significantly higher for most of them. Would also pay more for some services that had to now buy more expensive equipment and products. This would drive up inflation. The only ones who would benefit would be the US manufacturing companies, their suppliers, and those that worked for them, including the unions. It would hurt more people than it helped.

I don't want to pay 2-3x as much for a lot of stuff I buy at the store in order to bring back a bunch of US manufacturing jobs.

Job churn is here to stay.

[youngterrier]

wow. there is so much failure in that post I don't know which concept to address first. As long as we have people who rise up with their entitlement complexes and ask "hey, why can't we have a bigger piece of the pie?" we will not have manufacturing jobs in America. Minimum wage will continue to increase and corporations will continue to send jobs overseas because it is cheaper. Free Trade benefits us all, we pay cheaper prices for products that are most of the time of the same quality of American made products. We save money and are therefore able to use that money to invest in other things, leading to us all benefiting. Why do I have to give you a basic economics lesson?

There is nothing basic about the concept of free trade. It's a complicated issue and you trying to dismiss it as otherwise shows your ignorance a little.

It seems pretty basic to me, the effects of it at least. You trying to dismiss the positive effects of having cheaper goods on the market shows your ignorance a lot.

[BDKJMU]

So the US should ignore the environment, human rights etc?


Buchanan is screwed in the head.


What we need is to stop importing goods from them, and bring manufacturing back to the US. Yeah, the robber barons of Wall Street may make a few less bucks, but everyone else wins.

Wrong. The majority of the country not working in manufacturing loses- they end up paying a lot more for many goods and some services.

[kalm]

There is nothing basic about the concept of free trade. It's a complicated issue and you trying to dismiss it as otherwise shows your ignorance a little.

It seems pretty basic to me, the effects of it at least. You trying to dismiss the positive effects of having cheaper goods on the market shows your ignorance a lot.

Yes, it is apparent that it seems basic to you.

Cheaper goods come with a price. Stagnant wages, greater personal debt, greater international debt so that we have cheap things we can't afford? These things make the entitlement programs you're against even more neccessary. Please tell me how free trade has helped America.

[youngterrier]

It seems pretty basic to me, the effects of it at least. You trying to dismiss the positive effects of having cheaper goods on the market shows your ignorance a lot.

Yes, it is apparent that it seems basic to you.

Cheaper goods come with a price. Stagnant wages, greater personal debt, greater international debt so that we have cheap things we can't afford? These things make the entitlement programs you're against even more neccessary. Please tell me how free trade has helped America.

if we didn't have rampant inflation caused by the fed and entitlement programs that cripple the job-makers with taxes, as well as minimum wage laws we wouldn't have as much poverty and finding jobs wouldn't be as hard either. Not to mention it would be easier to make a living for one's self if he is paid in currency that is of greater value (blame the fed for inflation). Stagnant wages and international debt are to be blamed on the government. With our current monetary policy we are stuck on a boom-bust cycle, if we ended the fed, we would be forced to cut down on debt and wages would be more consistent and robust. You pulled the personal debt idea being because of low prices right out of your ass. Free trade has helped America through cheaper goods, if there was less government involvement in the marketplace it would be even better for the economy