51% of Republicans believe Obama was not born in US

[Skjellyfetti]

For those that know more about this than me (because honestly I have never really been interested in knowing until now). When one parent is a citizen of the US and you are born outside of the US, you are not considered a natural born citizen simply because of the place of your birth. Is that correct?

Yeah. You're a citizen if you're born to a citizen outside the US, but you're not "natural born." That's determined by place of birth and not by blood.

[OL FU]

For those that know more about this than me (because honestly I have never really been interested in knowing until now). When one parent is a citizen of the US and you are born outside of the US, you are not considered a natural born citizen simply because of the place of your birth. Is that correct?

Yeah. You're a citizen if you're born to a citizen outside the US, but you're not "natural born." That's determined by place of birth and not by blood.

Interesting and thanks. We need a constitutional amendment to change that one

[89Hen]

It is a terrible question. Throwing "possibility" in there allows for far too much interpretation.

If you want to move the number of positive responses higher.... sure, it would be a great question... but, it would be misleading.

I think it's an interesting question because it shows how untruthful partisans can be. If somebody can't even admit to the possibility, there's not much hope for them to ever offer much in the way an objective opinion.

Is it possible all the birthers are clinically insane? YES

See, that's not very hard to admit.

[89Hen]

Interesting and thanks. We need a constitutional amendment to change that one

Not sure I agree.

[GannonFan]

For those that know more about this than me (because honestly I have never really been interested in knowing until now). When one parent is a citizen of the US and you are born outside of the US, you are not considered a natural born citizen simply because of the place of your birth. Is that correct?

Yeah. You're a citizen if you're born to a citizen outside the US, but you're not "natural born." That's determined by place of birth and not by blood.

I think you're jumping the gun there - I don't believe that question has ever been clearly ruled on. There's been no definitive ruling on that one way or the other. That's why birthers are still after Obama and why Democratic birthers were all ready to do the same against McCain. There's no clearly defined ruling of what "natural born" means.

[SuperHornet]

Yeah. You're a citizen if you're born to a citizen outside the US, but you're not "natural born." That's determined by place of birth and not by blood.

Interesting and thanks. We need a constitutional amendment to change that one

The problem with that, as SD will tell you, is that if we make THAT change, many of us know who will be first in line to try to take advantage of that. And let me tell you from experience that while I don't believe he'd ever even get a whiff of the White House outside of being a guest, if he ever were elected, we'll consider Obama a kitty cat compared to him.

That said, about the "birther" issue: what I personally believe about it and what can be practically done about it are two entirely different things. Since no birth certificate has been produced, I'm inclined to believe that he was illegally elected. But doing something about that is an entirely different animal. It's too late to do anything about that short of impeachment. But I don't believe fraudulent election is covered in the impeachment portion of the Constitution. And as much as we conservatives don't like his politics, he hasn't done any of the things covered by those provisions, so impeachment is a non-starter at this point. The thing to do is get him voted out at the next regularly scheduled opportunity, namely 2012. At this point, especially since we've never seen the birth certificate for any other candidate for any other office, it should be dropped with a focus on kicking him out in the normal election process.

[Appaholic]

It is a terrible question. Throwing "possibility" in there allows for far too much interpretation.

If you want to move the number of positive responses higher.... sure, it would be a great question... but, it would be misleading.

I think it's an interesting question because it shows how untruthful partisans can be. If somebody can't even admit to the possibility, there's not much hope for them to ever offer much in the way an objective opinion.

Is it possible all the birthers are clinically insane? YES

See, that's not very hard to admit.

What determines that, Hen? I mean, the dude has produced a certified birth certificate, so it shouldn't be possible that he was born anywhere else but Hawaii. But it is possible someone forged that birth certificate...and it's possible someone forged yours, mine, Skelly's....I mean, there is only one 100% certainty in life...death. So the Birthers are basically saying no amount of proof provided to them will change their opinion that he was born elsewhere becuase there is a possibility (however remote) that the BC is forged.....it's a can't win situation...

[Appaholic]

Since no birth certificate has been produced, I'm inclined to believe that he was illegally elected........At this point, especially since we've never seen the birth certificate for any other candidate for any other office, it should be dropped with a focus on kicking him out in the normal election process.

Have you seen a birth certificate for Jesus Christ? Yet you accept his claims with far flimsier evidence... ...Un-fokking-believable....

[Skjellyfetti]

I think you're jumping the gun there - I don't believe that question has ever been clearly ruled on. There's been no definitive ruling on that one way or the other. That's why birthers are still after Obama and why Democratic birthers were all ready to do the same against McCain. There's no clearly defined ruling of what "natural born" means.

Dred Scott decision defined "natural born" as place of birth:

The first section of the second article of the Constitution uses the language, 'a natural born citizen.' It thus assumes that citizenship may be acquired by birth. Undoubtedly, this language of the Constitution was used in reference to that principle of public law, well understood in this country at the time of the adoption of the Constitution, which referred citizenship to the place of birth.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/h ... 93_ZO.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TwinTownBisonFan]

here again... in the 4 years of his candidacy and the two years of his term... nobody CREDIBLE has been able to produce any ACTUAL EVIDENCE to bring the issue to a point where anyone legitimate or serious is able to do anything about it. and considering the vitriol on the right (who's leaders know this is bullshit but stoke the flames anyway without ever doing anything about it... ever wonder why?) the fact that they haven't done anything real and tangible to act on it ought to tell you something.

[OL FU]

Interesting and thanks. We need a constitutional amendment to change that one

Not sure I agree.

that's fine. It just seems like into today's interconnected world an American could easily be living in another country for a short period of time, give birth to a baby and that baby simply because of that American's job or school is eliminated from being president. I understand what the founders were doing but it does sound a little extreme in today's world.

[OL FU]

Interesting and thanks. We need a constitutional amendment to change that one

The problem with that, as SD will tell you, is that if we make THAT change, many of us know who will be first in line to try to take advantage of that. And let me tell you from experience that while I don't believe he'd ever even get a whiff of the White House outside of being a guest, if he ever were elected, we'll consider Obama a kitty cat compared to him.

.

You will have to explain it to me if you want me to understand

[Appaholic]

The problem with that, as SD will tell you, is that if we make THAT change, many of us know who will be first in line to try to take advantage of that. And let me tell you from experience that while I don't believe he'd ever even get a whiff of the White House outside of being a guest, if he ever were elected, we'll consider Obama a kitty cat compared to him.

.

You will have to explain it to me if you want me to understand

Ah-nold....he'll be back....

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

I am surprised that the 51% number is so low.

Anyone with a brain knows the guys not legit. Anyone of you could BUY a birth certificate in Hawaii within the week. Thats why he chose Hawaii, they are purchasable there.

[89Hen]

What determines that, Hen? I mean, the dude has produced a certified birth certificate, so it shouldn't be possible that he was born anywhere else but Hawaii.

[Appaholic]

here again... in the 4 years of his candidacy and the two years of his term... nobody CREDIBLE has been able to produce any ACTUAL EVIDENCE to bring the issue to a point where anyone legitimate or serious is able to do anything about it. and considering the vitriol on the right (who's leaders know this is bullshit but stoke the flames anyway without ever doing anything about it... ever wonder why?) the fact that they haven't done anything real and tangible to act on it ought to tell you something.

I know....it's fokking amazing...I consider most of the guys on here intelligent people although I may not agree with them....buyt when they start spouting this BS....it's unbelievable...Obama has given the Right so many opportunities to engage the opposition in intelligent policy debates....but they come back with the birth certificate...amazing....

[Appaholic]

What determines that, Hen? I mean, the dude has produced a certified birth certificate, so it shouldn't be possible that he was born anywhere else but Hawaii.

(who knew Dback was Asian?)

[89Hen]

here again... in the 4 years of his candidacy and the two years of his term... nobody CREDIBLE has been able to produce any ACTUAL EVIDENCE

Nobody also proved that unicorns don't exist.

Look, I'm far from a birther. All I'm saying is that it's possible he wasn't born in Hawaii.

[OL FU]

(who knew Dback was Asian?)

Does Travis know

[Appaholic]

here again... in the 4 years of his candidacy and the two years of his term... nobody CREDIBLE has been able to produce any ACTUAL EVIDENCE

Nobody also proved that unicorns don't exist.

Look, I'm far from a birther. All I'm saying is that it's possible he wasn't born in Hawaii.

It's possible Reagan was born elsewhere....it's possible Ike was born elsewhere...alot of things are possible....it's possible that unicorns do exist (Bigfoot has a ranch full of them on the Frint Range)....

[89Hen]

Obama has given the Right so many opportunities to engage the opposition in intelligent policy debates....but they come back with the birth certificate...amazing....

[OL FU]

You will have to explain it to me if you want me to understand

Ah-nold....he'll be back....

I didn't know that Arnold's parents were American citizens

[Appaholic]

Ah-nold....he'll be back....

I didn't know that Arnold's parents were American citizens

They're not...I was guessing who SH was referring to....

[Wedgebuster]

(who knew Dback was Asian?)

Does Travis know

[Appaholic]

Obama has given the Right so many opportunities to engage the opposition in intelligent policy debates....but they come back with the birth certificate...amazing....

I'm not talking about him personally engaging in the debate, I meant his actions / policies / etc. have given the right so many opportunities to legitimately challenge his decisions / values, yet they seem to focus on his birth certificate....engage the Dems in a debate of substance, not speculation reserved for the whacko-wing of the ultra-right........