NDSU NEXT GAME:Lafayette Leopards @ NDSU BISON Preview Alert

[JBB]

Obviously these guys will never quit talking about the poor officiating at the NDSU @ EWU matchup. I dont know why they are so obsessed with it, but my guess is they have a problem with some folks seeing it for what it was.

I have two hopes/concerns about officiating:

1) CONCERN: Poor officiating promotes cheating. Schools like EWU are receiving pavlovian conditioning. I hope it doesn't lead to even more of this type of thing.

2) HOPE: I hope the game with Layfette is top notched with regard to officiating. I suspect it will, and certainly have every confidence it will.

A sense of entitlement to having something you didn't earn is at the heart of this formally great countries problems. I would sure hate to see the Lafayette games credibility ruined by poor officiating. Those situations do nothing for the game and, in the end, the team that gets the undeserved reward ends up hurt the most. CASE IN POINT: Look at how these EWU and BSC fans cant let this go.

Its a shame really.

[grizzaholic]

Obviously these guys will never quit talking about the poor officiating at the NDSU @ EWU matchup. I dont know why they are so obsessed with it, but my guess is they have a problem with some folks seeing it for what it was.

I have two hopes/concerns about officiating:

1) CONCERN: Poor officiating promotes cheating. Schools like EWU are receiving pavlovian conditioning. I hope it doesn't lead to even more of this type of thing.

2) HOPE: I hope the game with Layfette is top notched with regard to officiating. I suspect it will, and certainly have every confidence it will.

A sense of entitlement to having something you didn't earn is at the heart of this formally great countries problems. I would sure hate to see the Lafayette games credibility ruined by poor officiating. Those situations do nothing for the game and, in the end, the team that gets the undeserved reward ends up hurt the most. CASE IN POINT: Look at how these EWU and BSC fans cant let this go.

Its a shame really.

You are the one that brings up officiating every other post.

[Grizalltheway]

You're just trying to fuck with us at this point, right? Honestly, there's no way you could be THIS unaware of your own posts/inability to move on re: the officiating in that game.

[Gil Dobie]

[youtube][/youtube]

[Grizo406]

Obviously these guys will never quit talking about the poor officiating at the NDSU @ EWU matchup. I dont know why they are so obsessed with it, but my guess is they have a problem with some folks seeing it for what it was.

I have two hopes/concerns about officiating:

1) CONCERN: Poor officiating promotes cheating. Schools like EWU are receiving pavlovian conditioning. I hope it doesn't lead to even more of this type of thing.

2) HOPE: I hope the game with Layfette is top notched with regard to officiating. I suspect it will, and certainly have every confidence it will.

A sense of entitlement to having something you didn't earn is at the heart of this formally great countries problems. I would sure hate to see the Lafayette games credibility ruined by poor officiating. Those situations do nothing for the game and, in the end, the team that gets the undeserved reward ends up hurt the most. CASE IN POINT: Look at how these EWU and BSC fans cant let this go.

Its a shame really.

I think I'm finally startin' to understand & get your point of view, JBB! It took me awhile, but I thank you for opening my eyes!

Hopefully, at some point in time, EWU & the rest of the BSC fans will too! CASE IN POINT: That the previously mentioned football fans will recognize that the NDSU Bisons are a very large part of new FCS elite.

It's most certainly a shame they haven't already, and I weep for those that just don't understand!

Best of luck to the Bison in the upcoming football season!

[kalm]

A sense of entitlement to having something you didn't earn is at the heart of this formally great countries problems. I would sure hate to see the Lafayette games credibility ruined by poor officiating. Those situations do nothing for the game and, in the end, the team that gets the undeserved reward ends up hurt the most.

Its a shame really.

So EdubU is the Goldman-Sachs of FCS?

[clenz]

When it comes to penalties...It looks like NDSU cheats the most out of any MVFC teams

NDSU gave up the most yardage per game to penalties of any MVFC team this past season
Yards per game/Yards per penalty
1. Southern Illinois 45.0/8.8
2. Northern Iowa 52.0/8.9
Indiana State 52.0/8.7
4. Missouri State 52.8/8.7
5. Youngstown State 55.8/9.4
6. South Dakota State 57.0/9.4
7. Illinois State 58.5/8.7
8. Western Illinois 59.2/8.8
9. North Dakota State 64/8.6

So, they didn't get called for the 15 yarder like some teams did...but it seems that NDSU couldn't control their lines that get called for the 5-10 yard penalties. Talk about a lack of team discipline

They also had the most penalties...by far
In order of penalties overall
1. Southern Illinois 56
2. Youngstown State 65
3. Indiana State 66
4. Missouri State 67
South Dakota State 67
6. Northern Iowa 70
7. Illinois State 74
8. Western Illinois 87
9. North Dakota State 104

Maybe that is only because they played more games than the other MVFC teams

Penalties per game
1. Southern Illinois - 5.09
2 Northern Iowa - 5.83
3 Youngstown State - 5.91
4. Indiana State - 6.00
5. Missouri State - 6.09
South Dakota State -6.09
7. Western Illinois - 6.69
8. Illinois State - 6.72
9. North Dakota State - 7.43

Well, that isn't it either.

[houndawg]

When it comes to penalties...It looks like NDSU cheats the most out of any MVFC teams

NDSU gave up the most yardage per game to penalties of any MVFC team this past season
Yards per game/Yards per penalty
1. Southern Illinois 45.0/8.8
2. Northern Iowa 52.0/8.9
Indiana State 52.0/8.7
4. Missouri State 52.8/8.7
5. Youngstown State 55.8/9.4
6. South Dakota State 57.0/9.4
7. Illinois State 58.5/8.7
8. Western Illinois 59.2/8.8
9. North Dakota State 64/8.6

So, they didn't get called for the 15 yarder like some teams did...but it seems that NDSU couldn't control their lines that get called for the 5-10 yard penalties. Talk about a lack of team discipline

They also had the most penalties...by far
In order of penalties overall
1. Southern Illinois 56
2. Youngstown State 65
3. Indiana State 66
4. Missouri State 67
South Dakota State 67
6. Northern Iowa 70
7. Illinois State 74
8. Western Illinois 87
9. North Dakota State 104

Maybe that is only because they played more games than the other MVFC teams

Penalties per game
1. Southern Illinois - 5.09
2 Northern Iowa - 5.83
3 Youngstown State - 5.91
4. Indiana State - 6.00
5. Missouri State - 6.09
South Dakota State -6.09
7. Western Illinois - 6.69
8. Illinois State - 6.72
9. North Dakota State - 7.43

Well, that isn't it either.

Wow, the MVC leader by a wide margin.......generally a situation like this is indicative of weak fundamentals, lack of speed, and poor coaching. Or you're getting torched so often that it comes down to cheat of give up points.....

[Gil Dobie]

Wow, the MVC leader by a wide margin.......generally a situation like this is indicative of weak fundamentals, lack of speed, and poor coaching. Or you're getting torched so often that it comes down to cheat of give up points.....

Penalties have been a major issue since Coach Bohl took over.

[JBB]

First of all those statistics are menaingless within the context of my main point:

<<<<<<<POINT OF FACT>>>>>>>>>>>

The pavlovian conditioning I am talking about: Teams that are the benefactors of poor officiating have their bad behaviors reinforced and may be conditioned to cheat more in the future.

>>>>>>>end point of fact<<<<<<<<<<

The statistics presented above have to be presented within that context: THEY MUST BE ACCOMPANIED BY THE BAD CALL ROLL CALL and penalty record from the previous season.

In fact these statistics prove my point that NDSU has been the victim of either poor or vindictive officiating. Just take the two games that should certainly be in the hall of shame, EWU (included in national statistics all games) & UNI (included in the regional list above), out and NDSUs position would certainly improve.

The important statistics to help establish the point about conditioning and a disregard for the rules of the game are the statistics for the coming year. If we see those programs, EWU & UNI, decline in ther adherance to the rules we can at least link more cheating (the behavior) with the reward (unearned benefit) to the cause of poor officiating.

The statistics presented above are not relevant with regard to this debate, however, Gil is correct in what he says.

[houndawg]

First of all those statistics are menaingless within the context of my main point:

<<<<<<<POINT OF FACT>>>>>>>>>>>


>>>>>>>end point of fact<<<<<<<<<<

The statistics presented above have to be presented within that context: THEY MUST BE ACCOMPANIED BY THE BAD CALL ROLL CALL and penalty record from the previous season.

In fact these statistics prove my point that NDSU has been the victim of either poor or vindictive officiating. Just take the two games that should certainly be in the hall of shame, EWU (included in national statistics all games) & UNI (included in the regional list above), out and NDSUs position would certainly improve.

The important statistics to help establish the point about conditioning and a disregard for the rules of the game are the statistics for the coming year. If we see those programs, EWU & UNI, decline in ther adherance to the rules we can at least link more cheating (the behavior) with the reward (unearned benefit) to the cause of poor officiating.

The statistics presented above are not relevant with regard to this debate, however, Gil is correct in what he says.

Seriously, JaBBer, we need to get your football IQ coached up to at least the Pop Warner level.

The game with EWU was a textbook example of what happens when you're a step slower than your opponents, and don't have good fundamentals, JaBBer. The flags fly because your o line is holding, like eleven sacks vs UNI; same with your LBs and DBs - take the hold instead of the TD.

[Silenoz]

First of all those statistics are menaingless within the context of my main point:

<<<<<<<POINT OF FACT>>>>>>>>>>>


>>>>>>>end point of fact<<<<<<<<<<

The statistics presented above have to be presented within that context: THEY MUST BE ACCOMPANIED BY THE BAD CALL ROLL CALL and penalty record from the previous season.

Okay, doctor. Since we're comparing a football team to a hamster, care to share your thoughts on phrenology while we're at it?

[JBB]

Put up your statistics that are needed to prove your point. Calling people names only proves one thing: you are less than eloquent and probably poorly educated and of the lower classes.

[houndawg]

Put up your statistics that are needed to prove your point. Calling people names only proves one thing: you are less than eloquent and probably poorly educated and of the lower classes.

We're discussing the most penalized team in the MVC and how penalties are indicative of being over-matched and poorly coached on the fundamentals of the game. It was yourself that raised the issue. When you're giving up eleven sacks in a game or getting blown off the ball for 200 yards rushing in one half, that's when you're going to see a lot of penalties.

[grizzaholic]

Put up your statistics that are needed to prove your point. Calling people names only proves one thing: you are less than eloquent and probably poorly educated and of the lower classes.

Says one of the greatest name caller in the business.

[Silenoz]

Haha, how the hell would I do that? Pour over 660 minutes of game footage for 11 teams and find/log any and all instances of "cheating" (uncalled penalties) and then derive some statistic from that?

Let's just accept your argument as truth and add it to a football wiki somewhere:

JBB's theory of college football penalties:
The teams with the least penalties in all actuality are the biggest cheaters because they are reinforced to do it more because they get caught less. Ergo there is a directly inverse relationship between the number of penalties committed by a team and the number they were called for, which goes against all common sense but does explain why NDSU lost to cheaters UNI and EWU (and probably the Gophers in 08, and all losses to UND since 1993)

[Silenoz]

Put up your statistics that are needed to prove your point. Calling people names only proves one thing: you are less than eloquent and probably poorly educated and of the lower classes.

Wait, can you call someone out for name calling with name calling? Is that allowed?

[griz8791]

. . . Calling people names only proves one thing: you are less than eloquent and probably poorly educated and of the lower classes.

On the other hand, unbelievably bad spelling definitely indicates good breeding and above-average education.

[kalm]

Championship Subdivision (FCS) National Team Report
Fewest Penalties Per Game:

EWU 38th
UNI 43rd
NDSU 89th

http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/natlRank.jsp?y ... IAA&dest=O" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[EWURanger]

You can't say this thread hasn't been entertaining, though.

You try and make some sort of point and the jist of every response is "no, you cheat".

[houndawg]

Championship Subdivision (FCS) National Team Report
Fewest Penalties Per Game:

EWU 38th
UNI 43rd
NDSU 89th

http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/natlRank.jsp?y ... IAA&dest=O" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sloppy.



Speaks volumes.

[BisonMav]

The eastern teams are gracious opponents and win or lose with class. Marvelous fans.

[JBB]

Ok so there you have it. You have a conclusion about NDSU from the statistics and thats fine, but it misses the point.

Hypotheses: Teams on the good side of a bad call will a have a pavlovian conditioning to cheat more.

I think what it takes to prove that is the bad call roll from the previous season, the teams previous season penalty record, and the penalty record of the current season.

With that you can draw the conclusions.

On the spelling I have the excuse of typing error. The gentleman's behavior was inexcusable. Hence the observation about him. No insult intended. If he has presented himself poorly certainly he has another chance, wouldn't you say?

[Silenoz]

Just to be clear, the "name calling" I'm being called out on is the word doctor (in regards to your work in both statistics and behavioral psychology), correct?

I mean I know I personally rank doctor somewhere below the tier one words, such as "cunt" or "faggot, in terms of viciousness, and somewhere above words like "fucker" or "asshole"... but that's just me

edit: or maybe you were talking to houndawg the whole time
That would probably make more sense

[Grizo406]

Just to be clear, the "name calling" I'm being called out on is the word doctor (in regards to your work in both statistics and behavioral psychology), correct?

I mean I know I personally rank doctor somewhere below the tier one words, such as "cunt" or "faggot, in terms of viciousness, and somewhere above words like "fucker" or "asshole"... but that's just me

edit: or maybe you were talking to houndawg the whole time
That would probably make more sense

Strong work there, Silenoz!