Fate of Sioux Nickname starts in a few hours!!

[westsidebison]

they've used a nickname that sioux people dont want them to, standing rock voted SIX TIMES No on the approval to use the name.

Except that the tribe gave it to them.

[westsidebison]

Jesus, just let it end, no one in ND even cares anymore let alone outside of it.

Al Carlson and a couple people on SS cares if UND holds on to the name.

I get what your sayin Darell, but I must agree with Twentysix that this thing is getting really old. It's like the North Dakota version of the Lacey Peterson story. Just when you think it's over, and you never have to hear about it again, here comes another jackass throwing a wrench into with another legal challenge or whatever. Let's just let it die now please.

[Darell1976]

Its official...The Fighting SIoux name will be retired!!

http://www.valleynewslive.com/story/15996511/fig" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The House voted 63-31 on Wednesday to repeal a law that requires UND to keep the nickname and an American Indian logo.

[89Hen]

The pussification of America continues.

[griz8791]

Your good friends at Bisonville, citing the Settlement Agreement, think it won't be good enough to retire the old name without adopting and implementing a new one.

I'm still trying to find a complete written copy of "the Policy." The court's injunction order describes it as "a new policy to prohibit NCAA colleges and universities from displaying hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery at any of the Association’s national or regional championship competitions.”

Under the amended repeal statute UND will not be "displaying hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery" because it will not be displaying any "mascots, nicknames or imagery" at all. "The Policy" apparently does not require you to change your nickname (hard to be sure about this without knowing if there is more to "the Policy" than Brand's letters to UND). It only requires you to top using the Sioux name and logo. And since the Settlement Agreement refers to "the Policy" I don't see how they can put you back on the list of institutions that are violating "the Policy" when "the Policy" itself, which is the underlying reason for the Settlement Agreement, doesn't require you to change the nickname.

[Darell1976]

Your good friends at Bisonville, citing the Settlement Agreement, think it won't be good enough to retire the old name without adopting and implementing a new one.

I'm still trying to find a complete written copy of "the Policy." The court's injunction order describes it as "a new policy to prohibit NCAA colleges and universities from displaying hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery at any of the Association’s national or regional championship competitions.”

Under the amended repeal statute UND will not be "displaying hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery" because it will not be displaying any "mascots, nicknames or imagery" at all. "The Policy" apparently does not require you to change your nickname (hard to be sure about this without knowing if there is more to "the Policy" than Brand's letters to UND). It only requires you not to use it. And since the Settlement Agreement refers to "the Policy" I don't see how they can put you back on the list of institutions that are violating "the Policy" when "the Policy" itself, which is the underlying reason for the Settlement Agreement, doesn't require you to change the nickname.

UND was to retire the name Nov. 30, 2010. (the deadline of the settlement) Then they are required to install a new nickname or be in transition into a new nickname by August 15th, 2011. Well thanks to Bison-AL and his state law that messed everything up. UND announced its retirement after the deadline right around the beginning of the year UND was off of the list then according to BSC Commissioner Doug Fullerton UND was admitted because he felt the name was not an issue...then enter Al Carlson. The state law went into effect and that threw off the timeline on everything. UND has been on the H&A list since August 15th, 2011. Now with the retirement (AGAIN), I think the NCAA will allow UND this cooling off period to look like the good guy in all of this. Because they won, they got the most stubborn school to finally change their name. What happens with that lawsuit between the Spirit Lake Sioux Nation and the NCAA in 2013 is not of UND's concern since they are NOT involved. Either SL wins and UND has a shot at the name again...or SL loses and everything stays the same.

[northernfire]

Great post, precise and to the point. The ND Legislature has passed the repeal, the Govenor will sign and anything beyond this point will be, to quote Don Quixote by Miguel de Cervantes, "tilting at windmills."

[Darell1976]

http://nickname.und.edu/logo/wp-content/timeline.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

1889
UND's first baseball game was played. Referred to unofficially as "Nodaks" throughout upcoming years

1911
Student body officially adopts the name "Flickertails". An official logo was NOTcreated and athletes continued to wear North Dakota, Nodaks, ND, or UND uniforms.

For those questioning whether UND can get away with no nickname and logo look at these words!!!! If UND can get away with an unofficial name like Nodaks and not have an official logo back then, why can't they do it now.

[griz8791]

The important thing is the amended repeal statute complies with "the Policy" even if it arguably doesn't comply with the change-to-a-new-nickname clause in the Settlement Agreement. The purpose of the Settlement Agreement was to force UND to comply with "the Policy," not to amend "the Policy."

[Darell1976]

I think on UND's jerseys they should copy what N. Carolina and S. Carolina does and have DAKOTA on it and add the interlocking ND on their hockey jersey.

[lakesbison]

THEY ARE STILL ON THE SANCTION LIST.

NCAA can say "THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT WAS NOT REACHED"

[griz8791]

The settlement agreement does say that if they do not adopt a new nickname, they go back on the list of programs that have hostile and abusive nicknames. The logical problem with that is that UND isn't going to have any nickname at all anymore. If you do not have a nickname, you definitely do not have a hostile or abusive nickname. Yes, it is certainly possible the NCAA could interpret the settlement agreement the way you NDSU guys say it should be interpreted. But it will still be a fact that UND does not have a hostile or abusive nickname and that they are no longer violating "the Policy." Interpreting the settlement agreement the way you NDSU people want to have it interpreted would mean it is enough for every other school in the country not to have any nickname at all, but for UND only "the Policy" has a special meaning requiring them to CHANGE nicknames.

True, we are talking about the NCAA, which is not only hypocritical but also dumber than sh!t. But they are already being sued by one of the tribes and at some point they have to ask how much of a public-relations cluster-f**k they want to be in.

[Darell1976]

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/a ... id/220775/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BISMARCK -- Gov. Jack Dalrymple signed legislation this afternoon repealing the North Dakota law that mandates use of the UND Fighting Sioux nickname.

The state law is no more!

[Darell1976]

This was posted on siouxsports.com

Posted Today, 04:15 PM

Just got this email:

Dear Sicatoka,

I want to personally inform you of today’s decision by the North Dakota State Legislature and a statement by UND President Robert Kelley. I would encourage you to read through the entire statement.

Statement from University of North Dakota President Robert O. Kelley Concerning Today’s Decision by the North Dakota State Legislature:

"The University of North Dakota appreciates the work of the North Dakota Legislature this week in passing SB 2370. With the signature of Gov. Jack Dalrymple, this action allows UND to complete the directive of the State Board of Higher Education and to meet the terms of the 2007 settlement agreement with the National Collegiate Athletic Association by transitioning away from the current nickname and logo. This step will remove UND from sanctions imposed by the NCAA and will allow UND to continue to pursue Division I athletics in the Big Sky conference as a member in good standing – critical for the immediate and long term success of UND student-athletes and UND’s athletics programs.
The legislative process has been thorough and has allowed individuals and groups to voice their opinions regarding the issue. I want to reassure our students, faculty, staff and alumni – and all friends of the University – that the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo will be retired with dignity as it becomes part of the tradition and history of the University of North Dakota."

If you have any questions for me, please feel free to reply to this e-mail.

Sincerely,

Brian Faison
Director of Athletics
University of North Dakota

[Wildcat Ryan]

This was posted on siouxsports.com

Posted Today, 04:15 PM

Just got this email:

Dear Sicatoka,

I want to personally inform you of today’s decision by the North Dakota State Legislature and a statement by UND President Robert Kelley. I would encourage you to read through the entire statement.

Statement from University of North Dakota President Robert O. Kelley Concerning Today’s Decision by the North Dakota State Legislature:

"The University of North Dakota appreciates the work of the North Dakota Legislature this week in passing SB 2370. With the signature of Gov. Jack Dalrymple, this action allows UND to complete the directive of the State Board of Higher Education and to meet the terms of the 2007 settlement agreement with the National Collegiate Athletic Association by transitioning away from the current nickname and logo. This step will remove UND from sanctions imposed by the NCAA and will allow UND to continue to pursue Division I athletics in the Big Sky conference as a member in good standing – critical for the immediate and long term success of UND student-athletes and UND’s athletics programs.
The legislative process has been thorough and has allowed individuals and groups to voice their opinions regarding the issue. I want to reassure our students, faculty, staff and alumni – and all friends of the University – that the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo will be retired with dignity as it becomes part of the tradition and history of the University of North Dakota."

If you have any questions for me, please feel free to reply to this e-mail.

Sincerely,

Brian Faison
Director of Athletics
University of North Dakota

Then by all means, Welcome to the Big Sky North Dakota

[jcu27]

Welcome to the bottom of the Big Sky.

[mtjack]

Mtjack who is carnegie top 100? NDSU.
which athletic team has been to NCAA playoffs in every sport except baseball/wrestling NDSU.
Who was in the big dance & beat #8 wisc & #17 marquette? NDSU

all und does is DISHONOR native americans and.build a hockey arena with nazi-sympathizer money

I know it's hard to see through your gold and green goggles but UND, according to my many friends and relatives around the state, provides a lot of positives to the region just as NDSU does.

Pretty sure I'll regret this but so be it. Lakes, I'll bite on your "dishonor" comment. If all UND does is dishonor native americans than what the hell are you doing to make things better for native americans in North Dakota/Minnesota/the upper midwest? I hear this kind of crap all the time from my non-native friends. Have you ever stepped up to help make things better on the rez. Or is this just blind hatred of UND disguised as "behind the keyboard" activism? By the way, in most cases I feel that the majority of Native American mascots are tacky and dated but it's not my place to tell Native Americans what/when/how they should feel offended.

I eagerly await your response. Really.

[mtjack]

I think merely going by the name "The University of North Dakota" can be done is a dignified manner. Are they required to retire the nickname "Fighting Sioux" as well as the artwork/avatar?

[lakesbison]

mtjack. I work with the tribes buddy, ran numerous events for native american youth events. UND arrogantly used the nickname for years against the will of the native americans'. Even for argument's sake its a 50/50 division on the reservation's over the name.. ( PS NONE OF THEM GIVE A $HIT ABOUT THE NAME), even if its 50/50, you cant arrogantly use the name against the will of 50% that DONT WANT YOU TO. heck 25% that DONT WANT YOU TO.

I work with 2 sioux tribes & 2 chippewa tribes , I havent met 1 that says "hell yea, im a fighting sioux"



ps- to show you how IRRELEVANT UND is, if it wasnt for 1 delusional fan, 1 DARREL THE $7/HOUR MAN, no one on CS or AGS would even mention these racists.

[Darell1976]

mtjack. I work with the tribes buddy, ran numerous events for native american youth events. UND arrogantly used the nickname for years against the will of the native americans'. Even for argument's sake its a 50/50 division on the reservation's over the name.. ( PS NONE OF THEM GIVE A $HIT ABOUT THE NAME), even if its 50/50, you cant arrogantly use the name against the will of 50% that DONT WANT YOU TO. heck 25% that DONT WANT YOU TO.

I work with 2 sioux tribes & 2 chippewa tribes , I havent met 1 that says "hell yea, im a fighting sioux"



ps- to show you how IRRELEVANT UND is, if it wasnt for 1 delusional fan, 1 DARREL THE $7/HOUR MAN, no one on CS or AGS would even mention these racists.

Like I said Lakes you go to Ft. Totten, ND (Spirit Lake Nation) find a Native American with a Sioux shirt/jacket/jersey on and tell him to his face he is a racist. Type away when you return from the hospital. You go on to reservations and you see FIghting Sioux gear, you can see Washington Redskin gear. If you are go gung ho about this go to the Standing Rock and tell them they cannot have a school on their rez with the nickname Sioux( there is one with the nickname Fighting SIoux). Tell Mandan they cannot be the Braves, tell Warroad they cannot be the Warriors. You ONLY have hatred for UND not because of its nickname but because its UND and everybody here knows it. So shut up about your lies that you actually care what Native American's think about Indian nicknames or else have you been to Cleveland protesting the use of Chief Wahoo...I doubt it. One more thing Lakes are you going to be at the Fargodome and tell every Bison fan they now CANNOT say Sioux Suck or wear those Sioux Suck shirts. Because now its towards the Sioux people because there is no Sioux team anymore...again I doubt it.

[lakesbison]

YOURE (& you white ignorant fans @ und) THE RACIST, not the native american (are we really having that discussion, shows how out of touch you are)

An EDUCATED NATIVE AMERICAN FROM THE RESERVATION DOES NOT LIKE YOU & YOUR FANS HAVING THEIR NICKNAME.
you might find a radical few that are just ignorant and wear it to get people riled up, but sorry you and your fanbase are wrong.

Ive been telling the 1 or 2 times i've heard a sioux suck chant to STFU because we havent played them in 8 years.
Mandan & Warroad HAVE THE BLESSING OF THE TRIBES. (Standing Rock Tribe & Chippewa of 7 clans) und does not, you have 67% blessings of the measley 11% of spirit lake tribe (5000+ people)

Also, NCAA & BIG SKY havent gave approval yet, AD Faison sent out a email PRESUMING they approve, which they probably dont.

once again, you are the only und fan on these boards, you dont speak for anyone.

[Darell1976]

YOURE (& you white ignorant fans @ und) THE RACIST, not the native american (are we really having that discussion, shows how out of touch you are)

An EDUCATED NATIVE AMERICAN FROM THE RESERVATION DOES NOT LIKE YOU & YOUR FANS HAVING THEIR NICKNAME.
you might find a radical few that are just ignorant and wear it to get people riled up, but sorry you and your fanbase are wrong.

Ive been telling the 1 or 2 times i've heard a sioux suck chant to STFU because we havent played them in 8 years.
Mandan & Warroad HAVE THE BLESSING OF THE TRIBES. (Standing Rock Tribe & Chippewa of 7 clans) und does not, you have 67% blessings of the measley 11% of spirit lake tribe (5000+ people)

Also, NCAA & BIG SKY havent gave approval yet, AD Faison sent out a email PRESUMING they approve, which they probably dont.

once again, you are the only und fan on these boards, you dont speak for anyone.

Mandan is NOT on the Standing Rock Rez so they don't need permission. The name goes to the SBoHE, they changed Grand Forks Central's name Redskins, and the Warrior names of the Jr. High and Elementary schools (they also changed Wahpeton's and Devils Lake's to a more PC name. Wahpeton Waps and Devils Lake Satans. Warroad is NOT on a reservation and does NOT need permission from Seven Clans (which is NOT a tribe its a casino). The closest Chippewa Tribe to Warroad is the Red Lake Band of Chippewas which is not even in Roseau County. The state of Minnesota can change Warroad's name any time they want. So now the NA on the reservations that wear Sioux gear are not only racists they are ignorant. I will let my friends and relatives (who are Chippewas) who live in Devils Lake know this I am sure they will get a big over this.

Seven Clans Casino
https://www.sevenclanscasino.com/page/ourhistory" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[griz8791]

Lakes:

Please explain, without reference to the Settlement Agreement, how it would be "racist" for UND to proceed forward with no nickname at all and a logo consisting only of interlocking letters.

[northernfire]

[quote="Darell1976
Mandan is NOT on the Standing Rock Rez so they don't need permission. The name goes to the SBoHE, they changed Grand Forks Central's name Redskins, and the Warrior names of the Jr. High and Elementary schools (they also changed Wahpeton's and Devils Lake's to a more PC name. Wahpeton Waps and Devils Lake Satans. Warroad is NOT on a reservation and does NOT need permission from Seven Clans (which is NOT a tribe its a casino). The closest Chippewa Tribe to Warroad is the Red Lake Band of Chippewas which is not even in Roseau County. The state of Minnesota can change Warroad's name any time they want. So now the NA on the reservations that wear Sioux gear are not only racists they are ignorant. I will let my friends and relatives (who are Chippewas) who live in Devils Lake know this I am sure they will get a big over this.

Seven Clans Casino
https://www.sevenclanscasino.com/page/ourhistory" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;[/quote]

Speaking with colleagues who served at the Standing Rock Reservation while assigned to the Aberdeen Region of the Indian Public Health Service have indicated to me that individual members of that tribal nation were never allowed to vote on the Fighting Sioux issue. Can you confirm that?

[Darell1976]

[quote="Darell1976
Mandan is NOT on the Standing Rock Rez so they don't need permission. The name goes to the SBoHE, they changed Grand Forks Central's name Redskins, and the Warrior names of the Jr. High and Elementary schools (they also changed Wahpeton's and Devils Lake's to a more PC name. Wahpeton Waps and Devils Lake Satans. Warroad is NOT on a reservation and does NOT need permission from Seven Clans (which is NOT a tribe its a casino). The closest Chippewa Tribe to Warroad is the Red Lake Band of Chippewas which is not even in Roseau County. The state of Minnesota can change Warroad's name any time they want. So now the NA on the reservations that wear Sioux gear are not only racists they are ignorant. I will let my friends and relatives (who are Chippewas) who live in Devils Lake know this I am sure they will get a big over this.

Seven Clans Casino
https://www.sevenclanscasino.com/page/ourhistory" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Speaking with colleagues who served at the Standing Rock Reservation while assigned to the Aberdeen Region of the Indian Public Health Service have indicated to me that individual members of that tribal nation were never allowed to vote on the Fighting Sioux issue. Can you confirm that?

Standing rock although given petitions by tribal members were rejected by the tribal council to allow a tribe-wide vote. Of course what happened at Spirit Lake (tribe-wide vote = tribal approval) made up this councils decision to silence their member's view on the isssue.