Who is going to be the next Pope?

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Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by D1B »

American - doubtful - sex scandal taints all american cardinals. Too risky, but could be a wad of bubblegum in the crack of the dam holding back the millions of Americans and white Westerners who are leaving the church.

Hispanic - This would be my guess. In the not to distant future, Hispanics and Chinese will be fighting it out for last remaining scraps of food and water. Hispanics make up the largest catholic group. The downside is a macho, paternalistic culture that has kept chatter about child sexual abuse at a minimum, is beginning to break. As I predicted several years ago, there will be an explosion of sex abuse cases coming out of Latin America and like America, it's is probable that pope-eligible cardinals will be implicated in the cover up. IMO, this is what did in Benedict: that he was directly implicated in covering up sexual crimes against children or worse. We perhaps will never know for sure because the church is not transparent, but his resignation came shortly after the catholic church abruptly, and without adequate explanation, pulled out of the official investigation of the handling of sex abuse cases in Germany. See below for more on this issue.

Phillipino - See Hispanic above. Very similar situation. Don't see latinos or whites identifying with an asian pope.

Western European (non-Italian) - Could temporarily halt Europe's ascension from the ashes of christianity to human secularism, but they may feel Europe is a lost cause and go with someone else.

Italian - This would be my second choice, very close second. The Vatican is a fucking mess and unfortunately it almost requires an Italian to fix it.

African - African candidates are too racist, misogynist and homophobic to be a moral compass for the church in the modern world. Maybe next time, if they survive as a people.
1/9/2013 Huffington Post

BERLIN — Germany's Roman Catholic Church said Wednesday it has called off an independent institute's investigation into sexual abuse by clergy over several decades. The lead researcher complained that the church wanted too much control over his work.

In 2011, the church asked Prof. Christian Pfeiffer's Lower Saxony Criminological Research Institute to analyze data on abuse from German dioceses as far back as 1945, including material from church archives.

It was part of efforts to address the scandal triggered by revelations of abuse of children and youths in Germany, Pope Benedict XVI's homeland, and elsewhere.

However, the German Bishops Conference said "mutual trust is shattered" between the bishops and Pfeiffer, and it was terminating its agreement with the institute. It said it would seek a new partner for the project, without elaborating.

Pfeiffer said that researchers and church worked well together for the first few months, but then resistance emerged, starting with a call from the Munich archdiocese for the researchers "to bow to church requests for stronger controls" on their work.

A group representing German dioceses then called for the researchers' work to be submitted for pre-publication approval, Pfeiffer told ZDF television, a demand he said was unacceptable.

A statement from Bishop Stephan Ackermann, the church's point man on combating abuse, said that Pfeiffer's "way of communication with church officials" had made "further constructive cooperation" impossible. It did not elaborate.

A group that represents abuse victims, Square Table, said the latest development shows that the church is "unable to cope" with investigating the issue. It called in a statement for a parliamentary commission of inquiry into past abuse and church failings.

Justice Minister Sabine Leutheusser-Schnarrenberger was quoted as telling the Sueddeutsche Zeitung daily it's important that efforts to investigate the abuse scandal do not end in "half-hearted clearing-up."

The Munich vicar general, Peter Berr, rejected talk of "censorship" and stressed the diocese's "absolute will" to investigate past abuse. But he told Sueddeutsche Zeitung it's also important to discuss how that can be reconciled with the obligation to ensure diligence and the church's responsibility toward employees.

Benedict, who was then Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, served as archbishop of Munich from 1977 to 1982
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by CAA Flagship »

D1B wrote:Italian - This would be my second choice, very close second. The Vatican is a fucking mess and unfortunately it almost requires an Italian to fix it.
Oh God, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. :yikes: :ohno:



The pizza parties would be better though. :thumb:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by D1B »

CAA Flagship wrote:
D1B wrote:Italian - This would be my second choice, very close second. The Vatican is a fucking mess and unfortunately it almost requires an Italian to fix it.
Oh God, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. :yikes: :ohno:



The pizza parties would be better though. :thumb:
Yeah, not too thrilled about it either. If the church listened to the world and it's laity, it will appoint a younger, Hans Kung-like (liberal), reformer.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by GannonFan »

The guy from Canada (name escapes me - Ouellet I think) could be a very decent candidate. It definitely needs to be a person with a little more youth this time. Ratzenberger was already old when he became Pope and he didn't seem to have the energy to run the place and make the changes that were needed. But when a short-timer is elected, that's bound to happen. And obviously the new Pope needs to be very outspoken about the abuse cases and needs to be someone who will clearly take steps to address it. I think it would be a mistake to go with an older Italian guy, and that Scola guy would be an example. It's a worldwide church, not an Italian one anymore. I don't think, outside of Schonborn from Austria that any European candidate fits the bill of an energetic guy who could change the establishment. I'd put my money on Ouellet or Schonborn - I don't think it'll be a South American guy.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by Rob Iola »

It's only a matter of time before the Chinese buy the Papacy...
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by GannonFan »

Rob Iola wrote:It's only a matter of time before the Chinese buy the Papacy...
Well, the Chinese don't even recognize the Catholic Church - they've already set up their own, Chinese-approved and state run catholic church that meets their censor's approval. I think they're fine with that for now. They still need to stamp out the Dali Lama and countless other spiritual beliefs in their own backyard before they look outwards.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by andy7171 »

As we were walking to my truck this morning on the way tos chool, my ten year old says, "Hey Dad! We don't have a Pope!"

I immediately thought "Oh god, it's going to be a D1B day"

I'm betting the guy from NYC. He's young and energetic and would be a prime person to clean house and re-organize.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by kalm »

andy7171 wrote:As we were walking to my truck this morning on the way tos chool, my ten year old says, "Hey Dad! We don't have a Pope!"

I immediately thought "Oh god, it's going to be a D1B day"
:lol:

I was watching the news while on the treadmill yesterday and the camera shot was from behind the pope as a long line of cardinals were walking up and bowing down in front of the pope to kiss his ring. Of course all you could see was their head going down. And all I could think of was how D1B has corrupted us all. :lol:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by D1B »

GannonFan wrote:The guy from Canada (name escapes me - Ouellet I think) could be a very decent candidate. It definitely needs to be a person with a little more youth this time. Ratzenberger was already old when he became Pope and he didn't seem to have the energy to run the place and make the changes that were needed. But when a short-timer is elected, that's bound to happen. And obviously the new Pope needs to be very outspoken about the abuse cases and needs to be someone who will clearly take steps to address it. I think it would be a mistake to go with an older Italian guy, and that Scola guy would be an example. It's a worldwide church, not an Italian one anymore. I don't think, outside of Schonborn from Austria that any European candidate fits the bill of an energetic guy who could change the establishment. I'd put my money on Ouellet or Schonborn - I don't think it'll be a South American guy.
Good call on Ouellet. He's a strong candidate but seems just a younger version of Benedict. I don't think the church needs more of the same.

Now that they have the world watching and the veil of secrecy in Rome is lifting, you'll see the Vatican being run more like a legitimate business or proper organization. They now need a pope who can bring the Vatican from the 5th century to the modern age - morally and culturally, not another Rottweiler.

As you have noted in several posts, the church is already there for the most part, as most Catholics openly eschew church doctrine and subscribe to humanist ideals like tolerance, equality, embracing change, accountability and transparency. Time for the Vatican to follow suit.
From: AAP, February 18, 2013 12:40PM

CANADA'S Cardinal Marc Ouellet, a mainstream conservative churchman who once said becoming pope "would be a nightmare", is now widely seen as the North American candidate for the job.

Ouellet, 68, an insider with strong connections to the church administrative apparatus, the Curia, is a frontrunner to succeed Pope Benedict XVI, who has announced his resignation and triggered the hunt for a replacement.

British and Irish online bookmakers place his chances just behind those of Cardinal Peter Turkson of Ghana and the archbishop of Manila, Luis Antonio Tagle, who was made a cardinal last year at age 54 at Ouellet's urging.

He has faced strong criticism in his native Quebec for promoting the Catholic Church's traditional positions on gay marriage, abortion and other hot-button issues, but few think this will hurt him with his peers in Rome.

And if any of the cardinals who will meet in conclave to elect a new pontiff are seeking continuity, Ouellet was a trusted and orthodox advisor to outgoing the Benedict XVI candidate with a very similar vision.
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Branded the "Iron Cardinal" by Canadian media for his buttoned-down views, Ouellet could widen a rift between conservatives and reformists, according to Gilles Routhier, head of Laval University's theology faculty in Quebec City.

Born one of eight children to a school headmaster and his wife on June 8, 1944, in La Motte, Quebec, Ouellet studied philosophy and theology before being ordained a priest in May 1968 in his home parish.

He quickly rose within the church's ranks, being consecrated a bishop in 2001, and was personally named archbishop by Pope John Paul II the same year, along with being tasked with overseeing the Canadian church.

Two years later he was elevated to cardinal.

Many thought he could have succeeded Pope John Paul II in 2005 but, as a cardinal elector at the papal conclave, he reportedly threw his support behind Germany's Cardinal Ratzinger, who duly became Benedict XVI.

Ouellet is currently the prefect of the Congregation for Bishops and president of the Pontifical Commission for Latin America.

Formerly, as archbishop of Quebec and primate of the Canadian Catholic Church, he urged Canadian lawmakers against legalising gay marriage in 2005.

He also provoked a firestorm of criticism from politicians and feminists for strongly condemning abortion, even when pregnancy is the result of rape.

Ouellet also fiercely defended priests against the charge that anyone who opposes same-sex marriages is "a bigot, anti-gay and homophobic".

In 2007, in an unexpected concession, Ouellet asked forgiveness for past sexual abuse and discrimination committed by Catholics.

Two years later, his older brother Paul, an artist, was convicted of sexually assaulting two teenage girls in the 1980s.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

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GannonFan wrote:
Rob Iola wrote:It's only a matter of time before the Chinese buy the Papacy...
Well, the Chinese don't even recognize the Catholic Church - they've already set up their own, Chinese-approved and state run catholic church that meets their censor's approval. I think they're fine with that for now. They still need to stamp out the Dali Lama and countless other spiritual beliefs in their own backyard before they look outwards.
Think about it - they step in, fix the financial mess, pay off the abuse lawsuits, and apply their model to the entire world church, all while maintaining the current structure and status quo. That's raw power my friend...
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

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andy7171 wrote:As we were walking to my truck this morning on the way tos chool, my ten year old says, "Hey Dad! We don't have a Pope!"

I immediately thought "Oh god, it's going to be a D1B day"

I'm betting the guy from NYC. He's young and energetic and would be a prime person to clean house and re-organize.
:lol: Joe and I called a truce. Peace treaty negotiations to be held in the Post Impressionist Gallery at the Met Museum of Art sometime hopefully this spring.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by GannonFan »

Rob Iola wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Well, the Chinese don't even recognize the Catholic Church - they've already set up their own, Chinese-approved and state run catholic church that meets their censor's approval. I think they're fine with that for now. They still need to stamp out the Dali Lama and countless other spiritual beliefs in their own backyard before they look outwards.
Think about it - they step in, fix the financial mess, pay off the abuse lawsuits, and apply their model to the entire world church, all while maintaining the current structure and status quo. That's raw power my friend...
They can't do that - all their money is tied up financing US debt.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by 89Hen »

D1B wrote:
andy7171 wrote:As we were walking to my truck this morning on the way tos chool, my ten year old says, "Hey Dad! We don't have a Pope!"

I immediately thought "Oh god, it's going to be a D1B day"

I'm betting the guy from NYC. He's young and energetic and would be a prime person to clean house and re-organize.
:lol: Joe and I called a truce. Peace treaty negotiations to be held in the Post Impressionist Gallery at the Met Museum of Art sometime hopefully this spring.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by D1B »

kalm wrote:
andy7171 wrote:As we were walking to my truck this morning on the way tos chool, my ten year old says, "Hey Dad! We don't have a Pope!"

I immediately thought "Oh god, it's going to be a D1B day"
:lol:

I was watching the news while on the treadmill yesterday and the camera shot was from behind the pope as a long line of cardinals were walking up and bowing down in front of the pope to kiss his ring. Of course all you could see was their head going down. And all I could think of was how D1B has corrupted us all. :lol:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by Franks Tanks »

It should be a Hispanic because they are the only one's who actually care. I don't know if the church is ready for that however. It wasn't long ago that just a non-Italian white man from a country a few hundred miles away being pope was a huge deal.

Also Italian's don't like being around Hispanics because Italian's get confused for being Hispanic, and they don't like that.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

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Petrus Romanus :o
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

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Franks Tanks wrote:It should be a Hispanic because they are the only one's who actually care. I don't know if the church is ready for that however. It wasn't long ago that just a non-Italian white man from a country a few hundred miles away being pope was a huge deal.

Also Italian's don't like being around Hispanics because Italian's get confused for being Hispanic, and they don't like that.

The church (laity) is ready for anything but status quo. It's whether the conclave has the will to shake up their Vatican gig and the attendant Bacchanalian splendor, wealth and power.

There is no or little connection between the laity and their representatives in Rome.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by Ivytalk »

Rob Iola wrote:It's only a matter of time before the Chinese buy the Papacy...
Or steal it. :coffee:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by CAA Flagship »

D1B wrote:
kalm wrote:
:lol:

I was watching the news while on the treadmill yesterday and the camera shot was from behind the pope as a long line of cardinals were walking up and bowing down in front of the pope to kiss his ring. Of course all you could see was their head going down. And all I could think of was how D1B has corrupted us all. :lol:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

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kalm wrote: I was watching the news while on the treadmill yesterday...
The couch is much more comfortable. :coffee:
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by JoltinJoe »

I think the best choice would be Sean O'Malley, the Archbishop of Boston.

He's already cleaned up a mess in Boston. Is likely to roll heads if takes over at the Vatican. :thumb:

He's had to toe the line on doctrinal issues as a Cardinal, but my guess is that he's really not a strict conservative on theological issues. Just a gut. Think of David Souter and what happened to him when he got on the Supreme Court. O'Malley may not be Hans Kung, but I think he has more sympathy for Kung's theology than O'Malley may have previously let on.

He has a simple way of dress and appearance -- a Capuchin.

Probably not in the running, though, because he is an American. But he does have the best "reformer" credentials among the current Cardinals, IMO.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by LeadBolt »

CAA Flagship wrote:
D1B wrote:
The quicker we call it for what it is, the quicker things will change for the better.

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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by D1B »

JoltinJoe wrote:I think the best choice would be Sean O'Malley, the Archbishop of Boston.

He's already cleaned up a mess in Boston. Is likely to roll heads if takes over at the Vatican. :thumb:

He's had to toe the line on doctrinal issues as a Cardinal, but my guess is that he's really not a strict conservative on theological issues. Just a gut. Think of David Souter and what happened to him when he got on the Supreme Court. O'Malley may not be Hans Kung, but I think he has more sympathy for Kung's theology than O'Malley may have previously let on.

He has a simple way of dress and appearance -- a Capuchin.

Probably not in the running, though, because he is an American. But he does have the best "reformer" credentials among the current Cardinals, IMO.
:nod:

His Irish descent is certainly a plus and may help reel in that mess.
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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by CID1990 »

My money's on it being some dude.


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Re: Who is going to be the next Pope?

Post by CitadelGrad »

I'm pulling for the St. Louis Cardinal, Timothy Dolan, Archbishop of New York.
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