What Climate Change?

[Baldy]

The problem, I think, is that the general public has ALWAYS had too much faith in what it possible here. They think because scientists say it and it's described as "science" it must be true. But it is not and can never be true science. True science with respect to cause and effect requires controlled experimentation. And the situation just doesn't lend itself to that.

Yeah...^
Not so much Johnny

Science says the world is more than 6,000 years old and 40% of Americans disagree
Science says that Natural Selection is observable and suggests evolution 44% of Americans disagree
Something like 80% of Americans believe in Miracles (yes 80%)
Almost 20% of Americans think the sun revolves around the Earth
37% of Americans believe that "things" can be haunted / even after thousands of years of NOBODY on earth being able to provide ONE shred of hard evidence
25% percent believe vigorously in Astrology

Shall I keep going..?

Never underestimate how Stupid the Average American is
and Never over value Science... as a country we pay little attention (very little) to Science

Please Chizz, keep going, but provide a link to you statistics next time.
Thanks.

[kalm]

Yeah...^
Not so much Johnny

Science says the world is more than 6,000 years old and 40% of Americans disagree
Science says that Natural Selection is observable and suggests evolution 44% of Americans disagree
Something like 80% of Americans believe in Miracles (yes 80%)
Almost 20% of Americans think the sun revolves around the Earth
37% of Americans believe that "things" can be haunted / even after thousands of years of NOBODY on earth being able to provide ONE shred of hard evidence
25% percent believe vigorously in Astrology

Shall I keep going..?

Never underestimate how Stupid the Average American is
and Never over value Science... as a country we pay little attention (very little) to Science

Not to change the subject, but I want to meet some of these people. Home schooled I guess.

There's enough of them for Palin to be selected as a VP candidate, for Bachmann to be re-elected...

[kalm]

Chizzang is a VERY SMART, intuitive poster, and one of my favorites!

Although I only understand roughly 30% of what he says, the 30% that does get through, has made me a better person!

Thank you, Chizzang!

I made pretty much the exact same point in the 2nd post of this thread. The 2nd post! What the hell is Kalm?



Go suck on some beats Grizo

[TheDancinMonarch]

Not to change the subject, but I want to meet some of these people. Home schooled I guess.

There's enough of them for Palin to be selected as a VP candidate, for Bachmann to be re-elected...

As one who doesn't like either party I feel obligated to add that O'Bama got elected twice.

[kalm]

There's enough of them for Palin to be selected as a VP candidate, for Bachmann to be re-elected...

As one who doesn't like either party I feel obligated to add that O'Bama got elected twice.

Hey, I also don't like either party, but no, Obama is a muslim.

[Chizzang]

My point was that JohnStwrong loves telling us (over and over)
how much we over value science in this country
And that's just NOT true at all

about 1/2 this country completely disregards science almost as a matter of pride
and to instill hope in those who "hate science" our school system is rated as: abysmal in Science

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/techno ... tion/1138/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So Fear not:
America is primed to lead the world in Scientific Ignorance / Now and in the future

[93henfan]

about 1/2 this country completely disregards science almost as a matter of pride

Dude, it's way more than half.

We're lucky the 10% that are really good at science have made us so great the past 70 years.

The Chinks are stealing all of their ideas though, and are going to blow right by us soon as we continue to languish. Sad.

[DSUrocks07]

about 1/2 this country completely disregards science almost as a matter of pride

Dude, it's way more than half.

We're lucky the 10% that are really good at science have made us so great the past 70 years.

The Chinks are stealing all of their ideas though, and are going to blow right by us soon as we continue to languish. Sad.

On Firefly. Humanity is a spacefaring species represented by an intergalactic organization known as the Alliance. The official languages in the Alliance? English and Mandarin.

Sent from my HTC One V using Tapatalk 2

[93henfan]

Dude, it's way more than half.

We're lucky the 10% that are really good at science have made us so great the past 70 years.

The Chinks are stealing all of their ideas though, and are going to blow right by us soon as we continue to languish. Sad.

On Firefly. Humanity is a spacefaring species represented by an intergalactic organization known as the Alliance. The official languages in the Alliance? English and Mandarin.

Sent from my HTC One V using Tapatalk 2

I have no idea wtf you're talking about.

[DSUrocks07]

On Firefly. Humanity is a spacefaring species represented by an intergalactic organization known as the Alliance. The official languages in the Alliance? English and Mandarin.

Sent from my HTC One V using Tapatalk 2

I have no idea wtf you're talking about.

It's cool. Fox didn't get it either back in 2003

[93henfan]

I have no idea wtf you're talking about.

It's cool. Fox didn't get it either back in 2003

Still have no idea.

[AZGrizFan]

In a leaked June draft of the report's summary from policy-makers, the IPCC said the rate of warming in 1998-2012 was about half the average rate since 1951. It cited natural variability in the climate system, as well as cooling effects from volcanic eruptions and a downward phase in solar activity.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/science/2013/09/ ... z2fipLtq3A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hey, Analjelly? Remember when you INSISTED that increased volcanic and solar activity had little effect on global warming?

[93henfan]

Quoting FauxNews is always a FauxPas.

[LeadBolt]

The history of climate change shows constant flux. This was the case before mankind and has been the case since. Those who blame it solely on man's actions must ignore millions of years of evidence from the geologic record which show much higher temperatures during the dinosaur age and much lower during the ice age, when man wasn't on the earth in sufficient numbers (if at all) to make a difference.

The earth has natural cycles of cooling and heating upon which man has no effect. Any effect man has is most likely only at the margins and of much smaller consequence than the "sky is falling crowd" would have us believe, as is evidenced by the divergence of the actual data from the predictions of the global warming models over the last 15 years.

[YoUDeeMan]

...as is evidenced by the divergence of the actual data from the predictions of the global warming models over the last 15 years.

Yes, but with more advanced technology, we're getting much better at the being wrong stuff.

[Pwns]

The problem, I think, is that the general public has ALWAYS had too much faith in what it possible here. They think because scientists say it and it's described as "science" it must be true. But it is not and can never be true science. True science with respect to cause and effect requires controlled experimentation. And the situation just doesn't lend itself to that.

Yeah...^
Not so much Johnny

Science says the world is more than 6,000 years old and 40% of Americans disagree
Science says that Natural Selection is observable and suggests evolution 44% of Americans disagree
Something like 80% of Americans believe in Miracles (yes 80%)
Almost 20% of Americans think the sun revolves around the Earth
37% of Americans believe that "things" can be haunted / even after thousands of years of NOBODY on earth being able to provide ONE shred of hard evidence
25% percent believe vigorously in Astrology

Shall I keep going..?

Never underestimate how Stupid the Average American is
and Never over value Science... as a country we pay little attention (very little) to Science

I think what JSO is saying is that people overestimate and overvalue soft science. That is, sciences that don't involve actual controlled experiments. And often ignorance about the difference in hard and soft sciences is most pronounced in people who are on a high horse about not denying anthropogenic climate change and not believing in those silly things like supernatural forces and creationism. That's why people are gullible enough to believe power line magnetic fields can cause cancer but won't show any concern over getting an MRI . That's why people are so credulous about possibly getting cancer from cell phone waves that are of lower energy than light .

And furthermore, people who get all self-righteous about being "pro-science" also don't seem to understand how small in scope allele frequency shifts and genetic drifts are on the grand scope of the history of life. What "evolution" can be observed is vastly more simple than RNA molecules and living cells spontaneously forming from inorganic material and then spontaneously forming nucleated cells then spontaneously forming organisms with trillions of cells.

How people feel about God, evolution, and the supernatural is the least of America's science worries.

[travelinman67]

The history of climate change shows constant flux. This was the case before mankind and has been the case since. Those who blame it solely on man's actions must ignore millions of years of evidence from the geologic record which show much higher temperatures during the dinosaur age and much lower during the ice age, when man wasn't on the earth in sufficient numbers (if at all) to make a difference.

The earth has natural cycles of cooling and heating upon which man has no effect. Any effect man has is most likely only at the margins and of much smaller consequence than the "sky is falling crowd" would have us believe, as is evidenced by the divergence of the actual data from the predictions of the global warming models over the last 15 years.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rld0KDcan_w[/youtube]

Some folks push AGW for political agenda reasons, some out of self-hate, and some just don't get it.

[houndawg]

The history of climate change shows constant flux. This was the case before mankind and has been the case since. Those who blame it solely on man's actions must ignore millions of years of evidence from the geologic record which show much higher temperatures during the dinosaur age and much lower during the ice age, when man wasn't on the earth in sufficient numbers (if at all) to make a difference.

The earth has natural cycles of cooling and heating upon which man has no effect. Any effect man has is most likely only at the margins and of much smaller consequence than the "sky is falling crowd" would have us believe, as is evidenced by the divergence of the actual data from the predictions of the global warming models over the last 15 years.

Maybe true at current population levels, maybe more effect when the population doubles again. I recall listening to a Sagan interview where he was explaining the knife edge that life is balanced on, that if any one of several physical constants of the universe differed in the fourth decimal place, or even smaller in some cases, from where they are now that life as we know it wouldn't be possible in this universe. Not disagreeing with your statement just saying that the way population has exploded and is projected to keep growing I could see humans adding just enough input to be a tipping point somewhere down the line.

[DSUrocks07]

The history of climate change shows constant flux. This was the case before mankind and has been the case since. Those who blame it solely on man's actions must ignore millions of years of evidence from the geologic record which show much higher temperatures during the dinosaur age and much lower during the ice age, when man wasn't on the earth in sufficient numbers (if at all) to make a difference.

The earth has natural cycles of cooling and heating upon which man has no effect. Any effect man has is most likely only at the margins and of much smaller consequence than the "sky is falling crowd" would have us believe, as is evidenced by the divergence of the actual data from the predictions of the global warming models over the last 15 years.

Maybe true at current population levels, maybe more effect when the population doubles again. I recall listening to a Sagan interview where he was explaining the knife edge that life is balanced on, that if any one of several physical constants of the universe differed in the fourth decimal place, or even smaller in some cases, from where they are now that life as we know it wouldn't be possible in this universe. Not disagreeing with your statement just saying that the way population has exploded and is projected to keep growing I could see humans adding just enough input to be a tipping point somewhere down the line.

Actually there are arguments against that statement:

http://www.slate.com/articles/technolog ... oding.html

[travelinman67]

Maybe true at current population levels, maybe more effect when the population doubles again. I recall listening to a Sagan interview where he was explaining the knife edge that life is balanced on, that if any one of several physical constants of the universe differed in the fourth decimal place, or even smaller in some cases, from where they are now that life as we know it wouldn't be possible in this universe. Not disagreeing with your statement just saying that the way population has exploded and is projected to keep growing I could see humans adding just enough input to be a tipping point somewhere down the line.

Actually there are arguments against that statement:

http://www.slate.com/articles/technolog ... oding.html

Holy Feedback Loops, Batman!!
This suggests that Slate magazine tacitly acknowledges the existence of biological feedback (aka, real science). Heck, they even quoted a Prof. at Stoner U!!

Hey, Hotdog, you better report them to D.U. central command immediately; they need be silenced!

...and when you're finished reporting them, pull your chicken-little head out of your ass and join the real world.

[Chizzang]

And furthermore, people who get all self-righteous about being "pro-science" also don't seem to understand how small in scope allele frequency shifts and genetic drifts are on the grand scope of the history of life. What "evolution" can be observed is vastly more simple than RNA molecules and living cells spontaneously forming from inorganic material and then spontaneously forming nucleated cells then spontaneously forming organisms with trillions of cells.

How people feel about God, evolution, and the supernatural is the least of America's science worries.

Okay first of all if a person believes the world is a few thousand years old then all intelligent conversation regarding Genetic Drift are off the table... (completely) So it's absolutely critical to eradicate that level of stupidity before we can even begin

Secondly (and we can only discuss the second part if we get past the first hurdle)
4.5 Billion years and statistically significant shift are not a big leap...

[houndawg]

Actually there are arguments against that statement:

http://www.slate.com/articles/technolog ... oding.html

Holy Feedback Loops, Batman!!
This suggests that Slate magazine tacitly acknowledges the existence of biological feedback (aka, real science). Heck, they even quoted a Prof. at Stoner U!!

Hey, Hotdog, you better report them to D.U. central command immediately; they need be silenced!

...and when you're finished reporting them, pull your chicken-little head out of your ass and join the real world.

[D1B]

Actually there are arguments against that statement:

http://www.slate.com/articles/technolog ... oding.html

Holy Feedback Loops, Batman!!
This suggests that Slate magazine tacitly acknowledges the existence of biological feedback (aka, real science). Heck, they even quoted a Prof. at Stoner U!!

Hey, Hotdog, you better report them to D.U. central command immediately; they need be silenced!

...and when you're finished reporting them, pull your chicken-little head out of your ass and join the real world.

Tmanland

[travelinman67]

Holy Feedback Loops, Batman!!
This suggests that Slate magazine tacitly acknowledges the existence of biological feedback (aka, real science). Heck, they even quoted a Prof. at Stoner U!!


Tmanland

Wrong again, Godless One. The 400sf cracker boxes stacked upon each other are Progressive-Socialist urban planning. The so-called "tipping-point" and "peak" descriptors are psychological tricks used by extremist demagogues (environmentalists/libs) and car salesmen... ...like I said..."...some just don't get it."

[CID1990]

Hey look! Another anthropogenic global warming evolution voodoo versus science vanilla anal secretions from a beaver palooza thread! Awesome!

Lets all argue!