Who is the AL MVP?

Fact · Post by **Fact** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:44 pm

The top right number is the most relevant one, and Trout is an elite defender at the most premium position in the game. Cabrera is a butcher. Trout is an excellent base runner. Cabrera is a below average base runner.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:58 pm

Fact wrote:The top right number is the most relevant one, and Trout is an elite defender at the most premium position in the game. Cabrera is a butcher. Trout is an excellent base runner. Cabrera is a below average base runner.

Cabrera is a 1st baseman playing 3rd for the good of the team. He only had 13 errors in 153 games at 3rd, not bad for a big guy. He's a smart base runner, doesn't have to be great when he hits 44 HR's and 40 doubles. Of course he was better when he was younger. He is paid to hit and hit big. He has Prince Fielder hitting behind him, not Albert Pujols.

Fact · Post by **Fact** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:07 pm

It doesn't matter who's hitting behind you when you're hitting leadoff.

Brock Landers · Post by **Brock Landers** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:20 pm

Gil Dobie wrote:
Fact wrote:The top right number is the most relevant one, and Trout is an elite defender at the most premium position in the game. Cabrera is a butcher. Trout is an excellent base runner. Cabrera is a below average base runner.
Cabrera is a 1st baseman playing 3rd for the good of the team. He only had 13 errors in 153 games at 3rd, not bad for a big guy. He's a smart base runner, doesn't have to be great when he hits 44 HR's and 40 doubles. Of course he was better when he was younger. He is paid to hit and hit big. He has Prince Fielder hitting behind him, not Albert Pujols.

Fielder put up a .937 OPS this year, Pujols an .863

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:31 pm

Fact wrote:It doesn't matter who's hitting behind you when you're hitting leadoff.

It helps with your runs scored total.

Fact · Post by **Fact** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:37 pm

I don't care about runs scored. That's totally dependent on who hits behind you. Every advanced metric says that Trout has been better, and there's precedent for triple crown winners not winning MVP awards.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:37 pm

Brock Landers wrote:
Gil Dobie wrote:
Cabrera is a 1st baseman playing 3rd for the good of the team. He only had 13 errors in 153 games at 3rd, not bad for a big guy. He's a smart base runner, doesn't have to be great when he hits 44 HR's and 40 doubles. Of course he was better when he was younger. He is paid to hit and hit big. He has Prince Fielder hitting behind him, not Albert Pujols.
Fielder put up a .937 OPS this year, Pujols an .863

Cabrera's was 1.002 and Trout .958.........

Pujols had 80 extra base hits and Field had 64..........oh..and Cabrera had 84 and Trout 64

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:42 pm

Fact wrote:I don't care about runs scored. That's totally dependent on who hits behind you. Every advanced metric says that Trout has been better, and there's precedent for triple crown winners not winning MVP awards.

The SABR stats are high for Trout because he didn't play a full season.

Fact · Post by **Fact** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:43 pm

But he did play a full season. He's eligible for the batting title.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:50 pm

Fact wrote:But he did play a full season. He's eligible for the batting title.

139 games is not a full season, Cabrera played 161 counting tonight.

Trout was batting .354 at the end of July, then bombed to .284 in August and .254 in September during the pennant race. Cabrera's lowest month was April, a month that Trout played a couple games, and Miggy hit .298.

SuperHornet · Post by **SuperHornet** » Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:05 pm

Gil Dobie wrote:
Fact wrote:If Trout loses, I might destroy something. He is having a Willie Mays in his prime type of season.
Trout should not be mentioned in the same sentence as Willie Mays when it comes to baseball skills.

There isn't ANYBODY playing nowadays worthy of being mentioned in the same sentence as Willie Mays....

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:35 pm

Cabrera Wins AL MVP

Seahawks08 · Post by **Seahawks08** » Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:48 am

good for him. But it should have been a tie. Both Trout and Cabrera deserved it.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:59 am

Seahawks08 wrote:good for him. But it should have been a tie. Both Trout and Cabrera deserved it.

Both had great seasons, Trout played 96 complete games, Cabrera 142. Had Trout finished the season like he started, the Angels would have been in the playoffs and Trout would have won the batting title and maybe the MVP. His .287 August and .254 September during the pennant race really hurt Trout.

Seahawks08 · Post by **Seahawks08** » Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:08 pm

Had Trout finished the season like he started, the Angels would have been in the playoffs

didn't realize one man could bring you to the playoffs, especially not being a SP.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:54 pm

Seahawks08 wrote:
Had Trout finished the season like he started, the Angels would have been in the playoffs
didn't realize one man could bring you to the playoffs, especially not being a SP.

'One man can help bring a team to the playoffs. Without Cabrera, Detroit doesn't make the playoffs, IMO, that's 1 player and not a SP

dal4018 · Post by **dal4018** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 12:11 am

Fact wrote:I don't care about runs scored. That's totally dependent on who hits behind you. Every advanced metric says that Trout has been better, and there's precedent for triple crown winners not winning MVP awards.

Give examples of Triple Crown winners not winning MVP???

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:10 am

Fact wrote:But he did play a full season. He's eligible for the batting title.

Yes he did qualify for the batting title, the more games he play the lower his average went, as do most averages generally go down over a longer period of play. .280 hitter in August and .254 hitter in September. Cabrera was consistant and Trout fell below him in the batting race. You don't need to play a full season to qualify for the batting title.

Seahawks08 · Post by **Seahawks08** » Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:02 am

I'm not going to argue about who should have won b/c both had historic seasons. Trout was the better player overall, but like you said, cabrera could be argued to be the better player for his team. Then I could come back with the division crap and how the Angels had a better record, blah, blah, blah. Both deserved the award and should have been a tie.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:34 am

Seahawks08 wrote:I'm not going to argue about who should have won b/c both had historic seasons. Trout was the better player overall, but like you said, cabrera could be argued to be the better player for his team. Then I could come back with the division crap and how the Angels had a better record, blah, blah, blah. Both deserved the award and should have been a tie.

Just a friendly discussion, I respect your opinion Seahawk

Post by **AshevilleApp** » Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:27 am

dal4018 wrote:
Fact wrote:I don't care about runs scored. That's totally dependent on who hits behind you. Every advanced metric says that Trout has been better, and there's precedent for triple crown winners not winning MVP awards.
Give examples of Triple Crown winners not winning MVP???

Ted Williams in 1947.

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:59 am

Looks like a similar scenario this year. Cabrera is the best hitter, Trout a great hitter also. Again Trout is leading in WAR and Cabrera in stats. Are stolen bases and defensive range really important, or is it because Cabrera was out for a few games and Trout passed him?

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:05 pm

Trout could beat out Cabrera here, even after Cabrera had a better year than last year. Voters like the centerfielders that are good hitters.

Post by **andy7171** » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:08 pm

Chris Davis

Gil Dobie · Post by **Gil Dobie** » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:12 pm

andy7171 wrote:Chris Davis

Great year, but the 1st base thing will cost him.

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