NHLPA wants franchises back in Canada

[TwinTownBisonFan]

http://sports.theglobeandmail.com/servl ... ockey/home

those who have long imagined a day when NHL franchises would be repatriated to Canada from disinterested southern locales may find in that player unrest a force that could go a long way toward bringing it about.

We'll see... Gary Betteman seems bound and determined to foist the game on the sun belt cities... but ticket giveaways and slashed prices haven't built passionate fan bases for southern teams...

here's a better article on it

http://sports.theglobeandmail.com/servl ... ockey/home

[dbackjon]

Screw the Canucks - they couldn't support them back then.

And a second Toronto team would be the LA Clippers, part two.

What Maple Leaf fan is going to suddenly stop supporting them and start cheering for the Toronto Predators/Panthers?

[TwinTownBisonFan]

Screw the Canucks - they couldn't support them back then.

And a second Toronto team would be the LA Clippers, part two.

What Maple Leaf fan is going to suddenly stop supporting them and start cheering for the Toronto Predators/Panthers?

No, but the Hamilton Predators or Panthers would have a VERY loyal following. they are separate markets and both are capable of hosting a team.

as for your comments about other canadian cities... Winnipeg never had a severe attendance problem, they had a greedy owner who wanted a bigger TV contract. The Nordiques never really had an attendance problem either... however their market had a problem being a french only market (unlike montreal which is both) the undoing of Quebec was rooted in the Lindros debacle

[dbackjon]

As the NHL expanded in the United States, operating costs and salaries grew rapidly; this development hit the league's Canadian teams particularly hard. As Winnipeg was the league's fourth-smallest market (eventually becoming the third-smallest market after the Québec Nordiques moved to Denver in 1995), the Jets were unable to retain their best players. Various schemes were devised to save the team through a tremendous grassroots effort and government funds, but in the end the efforts were not enough. The Winnipeg Jets played their last-ever game on April 28, 1996, a home playoff loss to the Detroit Red Wings by a score of 4–1. Norm Maciver scored the last goal in Jets history.


Winnipeg was too small to support NHL back then...


And Hamilton, maybe. But the name mentioned in your article was a Toronto suburb...

[TwinTownBisonFan]

As the NHL expanded in the United States, operating costs and salaries grew rapidly; this development hit the league's Canadian teams particularly hard. As Winnipeg was the league's fourth-smallest market (eventually becoming the third-smallest market after the Québec Nordiques moved to Denver in 1995), the Jets were unable to retain their best players. Various schemes were devised to save the team through a tremendous grassroots effort and government funds, but in the end the efforts were not enough. The Winnipeg Jets played their last-ever game on April 28, 1996, a home playoff loss to the Detroit Red Wings by a score of 4–1. Norm Maciver scored the last goal in Jets history.


Winnipeg was too small to support NHL back then...


And Hamilton, maybe. But the name mentioned in your article was a Toronto suburb...

yeah... but with several teams in the NHL looking at heading to receivership at the rate their going... I think it would be good for the league to look at getting back to sustainable franchises with interested fans.

[dbackjon]

As the NHL expanded in the United States, operating costs and salaries grew rapidly; this development hit the league's Canadian teams particularly hard. As Winnipeg was the league's fourth-smallest market (eventually becoming the third-smallest market after the Québec Nordiques moved to Denver in 1995), the Jets were unable to retain their best players. Various schemes were devised to save the team through a tremendous grassroots effort and government funds, but in the end the efforts were not enough. The Winnipeg Jets played their last-ever game on April 28, 1996, a home playoff loss to the Detroit Red Wings by a score of 4–1. Norm Maciver scored the last goal in Jets history.


Winnipeg was too small to support NHL back then...


And Hamilton, maybe. But the name mentioned in your article was a Toronto suburb...

yeah... but with several teams in the NHL looking at heading to receivership at the rate their going... I think it would be good for the league to look at getting back to sustainable franchises with interested fans.

Or just contract...

[TwinTownBisonFan]

yeah... but with several teams in the NHL looking at heading to receivership at the rate their going... I think it would be good for the league to look at getting back to sustainable franchises with interested fans.

Or just contract...

the league won't do that... contraction is not healthy for the leagues image. relocation and adjusting expectations relative to the new league structure. (I also think a move back to the norris/smyth/patrick/adams division and divisional playoffs would help the NHL by building rivalries)

[dbackjon]

Or just contract...

the league won't do that... contraction is not healthy for the leagues image. relocation and adjusting expectations relative to the new league structure. (I also think a move back to the norris/smyth/patrick/adams division and divisional playoffs would help the NHL by building rivalries)

But if there are not enough viable markets right now??

[TwinTownBisonFan]

the league won't do that... contraction is not healthy for the leagues image. relocation and adjusting expectations relative to the new league structure. (I also think a move back to the norris/smyth/patrick/adams division and divisional playoffs would help the NHL by building rivalries)

But if there are not enough viable markets right now??

I think there are... I think it's a question of placement and expectations. Seattle seems ripe for a team given their position as a major market without winter sports. Kansas City too. Winnipeg would be a lot like Minnesota upon the return of hockey. Milwaukee could be considered but the Bradley Center might not be suitable. Hamilton is perfectly positioned for a team. Portland is also in a good situation.

thats 6 off the top of my head that would be decent.
and while these markets are smaller than say Phoenix, LA, Miami, Tampa, Atlanta and Long Island, it's probably better for the league to have teams that are supported...

[dbackjon]

One northwestern team might work - can't see both.

Seattle wouldn't build anything to keep the Sonics, don't see them building for Hockey. Not sure if Portland could support NHL and NBA.

Kansas City - Again, not enough money/support - less likely to succeed than any of the cities you want to move from. Same with Milwaukee.

Hamilton, could be.

[TwinTownBisonFan]

One northwestern team might work - can't see both.

Seattle wouldn't build anything to keep the Sonics, don't see them building for Hockey. Not sure if Portland could support NHL and NBA.

Kansas City - Again, not enough money/support - less likely to succeed than any of the cities you want to move from. Same with Milwaukee.

Hamilton, could be.

Seattle can use Key Arena with no problems... and KC has the brand new Sprint Center a beautiful place... and no winter competition.

I would agree on it being a mistake to put two in the northwest... but i think 2 more canadian teams would be good for the league overall. again, it's not a question of market size, but of support. I think a place with less competition for sports dollars in the market, rather than compete with the NBA, just find place the NBA isn't. On top of that, those markets are more likely to support a team given their support from the ground up for the sport.

there's a saying in NHL fan circles "No ice, no hockey" I think there might be something to that.

[dbackjon]

NHL in Key Arena would have many of the same issues that the NBA did - not a modern arena.

[dgreco]

Contraction would be horrible, but I think about 6-8 of the markets need to be moved. Phoenix, Nashville, Carolina, 1 California team ideally a southern Cal team, Columbus (even though a northern city just hasn't been great there), 1 florida team (probably Tampa since Miami is third biggest city in FL and has better cause for supporting a team), and then the Islanders....

Where to move them? one team in Kansas City, one team in Seattle, a team in Wisconsin (milwaukee probably), I guess a team back in Manitoba (even though I think Winnipeg can not support another team)... and then after that I can not give you 3 more cities. I would say maybe Hartford gets a team back, I think Hamilton is too close to Toronto, Ottawa and Montreal. Can the area really support 4 teams? Maybe Salt Lake could support a team?

[TwinTownBisonFan]

Contraction would be horrible, but I think about 6-8 of the markets need to be moved. Phoenix, Nashville, Carolina, 1 California team ideally a southern Cal team, Columbus (even though a northern city just hasn't been great there), 1 florida team (probably Tampa since Miami is third biggest city in FL and has better cause for supporting a team), and then the Islanders....

Where to move them? one team in Kansas City, one team in Seattle, a team in Wisconsin (milwaukee probably), I guess a team back in Manitoba (even though I think Winnipeg can not support another team)... and then after that I can not give you 3 more cities. I would say maybe Hartford gets a team back, I think Hamilton is too close to Toronto, Ottawa and Montreal. Can the area really support 4 teams? Maybe Salt Lake could support a team?

I think Hamilton can support a team... they support a CFL franchise in the shadows of Toronto, and the NHL is MUCH bigger.

Hartford will have serious arena issues... the Hartford Civic was deemed inadequate in 1995, nothing much has changed on that front.

what are your thoughts on Cleveland or Indianapolis? both are hoops markets, and the Barons were an utter failure in Cleveland back in the 70's (with intense WHA competition) to the point that they were merged with the North Stars. But i'd be curious as to whether or not they could sustain it...

I'd like the league to look at a totally underserved market like Albany, but the Times Union Arena doesn't hold enough for hockey sadly.

[dgreco]

I do not know if Albany could support a team. With Buffalo for the western half of the state and the NY/NJ teams in the east 3 is enough for that area. Especially since all the Canadian teams are so close. I like the idea of Cleveland and Indy. I think they might be better than a Hamilton team.

If you could move those 7 teams before and say:

Phoenix back to Winnipeg for the Jets
Tampa Bay to Seattle
Nashville to Kansas City
NY Islanders to Milwaukee
Carolina back to Hartford
LA Kings to Indianapolis

maybe keep columbus and have Carolina go to Cleveland. Or you could move a team like Atlanta to Cleveland and still have Hartford. The problem then is though is you have Miami way down there and the closest teams are Kansas City/St. Louis or Washington DC.

Of course we could move the south completely out and move Miami to Salt Lake.

[TwinTownBisonFan]

I do not know if Albany could support a team. With Buffalo for the western half of the state and the NY/NJ teams in the east 3 is enough for that area. Especially since all the Canadian teams are so close. I like the idea of Cleveland and Indy. I think they might be better than a Hamilton team.

If you could move those 7 teams before and say:

Phoenix back to Winnipeg for the Jets
Tampa Bay to Seattle
Nashville to Kansas City
NY Islanders to Milwaukee
Carolina back to Hartford
LA Kings to Indianapolis

maybe keep columbus and have Carolina go to Cleveland. Or you could move a team like Atlanta to Cleveland and still have Hartford. The problem then is though is you have Miami way down there and the closest teams are Kansas City/St. Louis or Washington DC.

Of course we could move the south completely out and move Miami to Salt Lake.

Miami only keeps their attendance up by giving away tickets... i think they should go... tampa was a decent hockey town, and I actually wonder if you could get a team in San Antonio or Houston to work (the minor league teams in both cities are pretty popular)

[Mountaineer]

Carolina back to Hartford

Carolina go to Cleveland

Eat a dick. The Canes are not leaving Raleigh anytime soon. Good fanbase, one of (if not THE) loudest building in the NHL, the only fanbase that tailgates all day before a game, and players actually enjoy living in Raleigh. Like they're gonna pack up and move to back to either of those two shitholes mentioned above.

[TwinTownBisonFan]

Carolina back to Hartford

Carolina go to Cleveland

Eat a dick. The Canes are not leaving Raleigh anytime soon. Good fanbase, one of (if not THE) loudest building in the NHL, the only fanbase that tailgates all day before a game, and players actually enjoy living in Raleigh. Like they're gonna pack up and move to back to either of those two shitholes mentioned above.

their attendance is solid, they've won a cup... they are close enough geographically to stay if the league left the rest of the south.

[bench]

Carolina back to Hartford

Carolina go to Cleveland

Eat a dick. The Canes are not leaving Raleigh anytime soon. Good fanbase, one of (if not THE) loudest building in the NHL, the only fanbase that tailgates all day before a game, and players actually enjoy living in Raleigh. Like they're gonna pack up and move to back to either of those two shitholes mentioned above.

This is true. I've been to a game at the RBC, it was loud, the place was packed, and they take it seriously enough that they look at you funny if you don't. We know just enough about hockey to know why people were cheering when seemingly nothing had happened, like a great save to keep the puck from crossing the blue line on the offensive end, but that's about it. So we treated it like it was a minor league baseball game, getting half shitfaced and yelling "Kick his ass, Seabass!" when appropriate. Now the folks above us thought we were a riot, but the bunch on our left gave us the stink eye they whole game. Good times all around

[Mountaineer]

their attendance is solid, they've won a cup... they are close enough geographically to stay if the league left the rest of the south.

Thanks man. I've seen good crowds in Tampa, Miami and Phoenix. All three are currently going through tough times, but winning will cure a lot of ills.

Now if there's a team to move it should be Atlanta, they should've never been awarded a team in the first place. Atlanta is a notoriously bad sports city.

This is true. I've been to a game at the RBC, it was loud, the place was packed, and they take it seriously enough that they look at you funny if you don't.

Raleigh has turned into a decent hockey town. Folks have picked up and really embraced the game. I've never been to a game at the RBC Center. I was there for the games in Greensboro though. When the Coliseum was nicknamed "Green Acres" and only a few thousand were in attendance The Canes and their fans have come along way and it's been great to see.

Proud to be able to say I've been a Canes fan since Day 1.

[dgreco]

I was just taking Carolina out to rid the south of teams. Miami does horrible with all sports teams. Even when they win they only show up for the playoffs. I have been to a bunch of panthers games this year and the deal was 2 tickets, 2 hot dogs, 2 sodas, a 5 dollar gas card, and free parking all for 34 bucks. You could not beat that.

They also had a deal buy a ticket and if they do not make the playoffs get 4 free tickets for next year. As for the rest of Miami sports, besides the Dolphins. People do not care. So I would say Miami would lobby hard to keep the team, but they really do not show anything that they deserve it.

[AppGuy04]

Raleigh is a decent hockey town now because half of the people that live here have a weird accent if you catch my drift

[dbackjon]

Raleigh is a decent hockey town now because half of the people that live here have a weird accent if you catch my drift

HOLY COW!!!!


Awesome to see you, man!!

[AppGuy04]

Raleigh is a decent hockey town now because half of the people that live here have a weird accent if you catch my drift

HOLY COW!!!!


Awesome to see you, man!!

Thanks bro, how you been?

BTW, a 2nd Toronto team, as has been rumored, would be the worst idea EVER!

[dbackjon]

HOLY COW!!!!


Awesome to see you, man!!

Thanks bro, how you been?

BTW, a 2nd Toronto team, as has been rumored, would be the worst idea EVER!

I am doing pretty good - tickled pink to see you on here - been missing ya!
You've missed a lot - a breakup, singledom, and now just recently a new boyfriend

Now - about those freaking Cubbies.