2014 NASCAR Thread

[93henfan]

Oh. Clenz, I forgot 1.5 mile tracks. The so-called Charlotte clones.

When NASCAR expanded outside the south, many of the newly built tracks in the Midwest, Texas, etc were nearly identical to Charlotte because it was the showplace track of NASCAR.

Well, now people hate seeing that clone style and it even has taken some of the luster from Charlotte itself. I've even heard people say "just another mile and a halfer" when talking about Charlotte and I want to choke them.

[89Hen]

BTW, I think TV is the #1 reason for lackluster attendance. 60" screens with surround sound, side by side during the ads so you don't miss a thing, MRN on XM... it's awfully nice to watch at home. Obviously a different experience than being at the track, but...

[clenz]

BTW, I think TV is the #1 reason for lackluster attendance. 60" screens with surround sound, side by side during the ads so you don't miss a thing, MRN on XM... it's awfully nice to watch at home. Obviously a different experience than being at the track, but...

DW makes me want to jab an ice pick into my ears though

[93henfan]

Yesterday, the Dover Downs CEO, Denis McGlynn addressed the crowd in pre-race ceremonies as he does before every race, but it had a different tone than in years past.

In recent years, with the crowd dwindled to its present state, he had a tone that appeared to be denial, thanking the many, many fans who had come to the race track, despite the fact that everyone could see the place was half full. They had covered entire sections of bleacher over with advertising tarps and reduced the "official" capacity of the track from 140,000 down to somewhere around 100K so they could say they were still at 60 or 75% or whatever capacity.

Yesterday was the first time that it seemed like Houston had realized it had a problem. McGlynn lamented the fact that so many people were not there directly to the crowd. He said that NASCAR has to find a way to get its old fans back and grow young fans. There was an article on DelawareOnline.com yesterday where they said he had encouraged all the drivers in the pre-race meetings to make themselves accessible to fans and to take as many photos with kids as they could.

I don't know if he had gotten an ultimatum from NASCAR or if he just senses that Dover will lose a race if they don't get back over 50% attendance.

[bandl]

Which will die first?
NASCAR or WNBA
discuss.

[93henfan]

Which will die first?
NASCAR or WNBA
discuss.

UD football

[TheDancinMonarch]

Which will die first?
NASCAR or WNBA
discuss.

Let see. Kyle Busch wins all the truck races. Kyle Busch wins all the Nationwide races. Jimmy Johnson wins all the Cup races. Isn't NASCAR already dead?

[bandl]

Which will die first?
NASCAR or WNBA
discuss.

Let see. Kyle Busch wins all the truck races. Kyle Busch wins all the Nationwide races. Jimmy Johnson wins all the Cup races. Isn't NASCAR already dead?

There's truck racing???


















Seriously? That's a real thing at this level?

[89Hen]

Can you bring your own cooler of beer into the stands 93?

[93henfan]

Can you bring your own cooler of beer into the stands 93?

Yep. No glass. There's a size restriction on coolers but is very loosely enforced.

[89Hen]

Can you bring your own cooler of beer into the stands 93?

Yep. No glass. There's a size restriction on coolers but is very loosely enforced.

That still amazes me (that you're allowed to do this).

[93henfan]

There's truck racing???

Shit bro, you should have seen it in the 70s when they raced actual big rigs. It was fucking awesome.

Also, for the NASCAR fans of later vintage, look at Dover back in the day. I miss those days.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usBljR-7Dmk[/youtube]

By comparison, same frontstretch when NASCAR was at its peak:

[Ivytalk]

There's truck racing???

**** bro, you should have seen it in the 70s when they raced actual big rigs. It was **** awesome.

Also, for the NASCAR fans of later vintage, look at Dover back in the day. I miss those days.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usBljR-7Dmk[/youtube]

By comparison, same frontstretch when NASCAR was at its peak:

I was an usher in Turn 2, section 204. What a dirty sport NASCAR is. I came home with my face covered with little bits of soot and rubber. When I put on sunscreen, it smeared the soot, and I looked like a bad B-movie makeup job.

[DSUrocks07]

Yesterday, the Dover Downs CEO, Denis McGlynn addressed the crowd in pre-race ceremonies as he does before every race, but it had a different tone than in years past.

In recent years, with the crowd dwindled to its present state, he had a tone that appeared to be denial, thanking the many, many fans who had come to the race track, despite the fact that everyone could see the place was half full. They had covered entire sections of bleacher over with advertising tarps and reduced the "official" capacity of the track from 140,000 down to somewhere around 100K so they could say they were still at 60 or 75% or whatever capacity.

Yesterday was the first time that it seemed like Houston had realized it had a problem. McGlynn lamented the fact that so many people were not there directly to the crowd. He said that NASCAR has to find a way to get its old fans back and grow young fans. There was an article on DelawareOnline.com yesterday where they said he had encouraged all the drivers in the pre-race meetings to make themselves accessible to fans and to take as many photos with kids as they could.

I don't know if he had gotten an ultimatum from NASCAR or if he just senses that Dover will lose a race if they don't get back over 50% attendance.

DD as a whole is a sinking ship going down fast.

Honestly I'm kinda glad I got out when I did back in February. Casino and race business is declining substantially. And they have no other cards to play.

[93henfan]

When PA and MD passed gambling, that sealed the fate of DE gambling. The busses from 1-2 hours away stopped overnight.

NASCAR is in a down cycle, as are many other sports like college football. Every track is hurting. It will rebound, though not necessarily to circa~2000 levels.

[DSUrocks07]

When PA and MD passed gambling, that sealed the fate of DE gambling. The busses from 1-2 hours away stopped overnight.

NASCAR is in a down cycle, as are many other sports like college football. Every track is hurting. It will rebound, though not necessarily to circa~2000 levels.

They should invest more in completing the stands and make it resemble more of a stadium and less of a 120k seat temporary bleacher set up. (120k since they pulled the whole "we're making the seats wider"...with bench seating...)

Enclose the shell, add more lights (not definitively for night racing but to illuminate the track anyways), go with chairback seating. Make the capacity closer to 105k. And look at getting other types of racing besides NASCAR. They need to fibd new ways to generate revenue...instead of resting on their laurels for the last 25 years like they been doing.

[BDKJMU]

I still like NASCAR but when I see all the empty seats and tarp covered sections at Dover today I have to wonder if the days of them getting two races per year should be over....

I'm at the race. Are you? If not, why? Perhaps Dover could use your feedback.

Anyway, it's not just Dover. Did you see the empty backstretch at Charlotte last week? The shiny empty spots at the Indy 500?

Even Bristol doesn't sell out any more, and that was once unthinkable.

Was there. Allison Grandstands (2nd time) Sec 111, row 42. Pretty good view of JR's pits- he was about 4 pits down to the left from where we were sitting.

Did the Park N Ride at the Blue Hen Corporate Center, which I'd done once before, but not the last couple of times. Yeah, was easy getting in and out. Probably was as much beach traffic as race traffic..

[BDKJMU]

Honest question

Did NASCAR get too big too fast and in a rush to stay a head got WAY to big WAY to fast (in terms of capacities, prices, etc...)

Yes, that is part of it. Along with several other items I have rehashed ad nauseum.

Cliff notes:
-NASCAR abandoned its core southern base by taking races away from North Wilkesboro NC (all of them), Rockingham NC (all of them), Darlington SC (one of them).
-Dale Earnhardt died.
-Great Recession
-Fuel prices - much of NASCAR attendance prior to 2001 came in gas sucking RVs - they could make it when gas was $1.25/gal in 1999 - not so much when it is triple that
-Chase format
-Car of Tomorrow
-Dominance of Jimmie Johnson (6 cups in 8 years and 5 in a row)
-Elimination of infield camping/spectating at majority of tracks after 9/11
-Too big, too fast that you mentioned. Many tracks doubled or tripled in size from 1985 to 2000. Typical ticket price went from $25 to $100. They are now dropping. My Dover tickets are $85 each down from $96. Turn seating goes for $50ish. My Martinsville tix were $60ish.

And notice of the 9 things 93 mentioned, 3 of them NASCAR didn't do themselves (Earnhardt's death, Great Recession, fuel prices). But all the rest was NASCAR's doing:
-Getting away from its Southern roots
-the Chase
-the COT
-elevated the dominace of JJ (under old format he only wins 3 of those 6 titles)
-elimination of infield camping/spectating most tracks
-too big, too fast

NASCAR tried to fix something that wasn't broken. Me thinks they's done none of the above (all of which besides too big too fast was done after 01') they'd be better off.

[BDKJMU]

Honest question

Did NASCAR get too big too fast and in a rush to stay a head got WAY to big WAY to fast (in terms of capacities, prices, etc...)

Yes, that is part of it. Along with several other items I have rehashed ad nauseum.

Cliff notes:
-NASCAR abandoned its core southern base by taking races away from North Wilkesboro NC (all of them), Rockingham NC (all of them), Darlington SC (one of them).
-Dale Earnhardt died.
-Great Recession
-Fuel prices - much of NASCAR attendance prior to 2001 came in gas sucking RVs - they could make it when gas was $1.25/gal in 1999 - not so much when it is triple that
-Chase format
-Car of Tomorrow
-Dominance of Jimmie Johnson (6 cups in 8 years and 5 in a row)
-Elimination of infield camping/spectating at majority of tracks after 9/11
-Too big, too fast that you mentioned. Many tracks doubled or tripled in size from 1985 to 2000. Typical ticket price went from $25 to $100. They are now dropping. My Dover tickets are $85 each down from $96. Turn seating goes for $50ish. My Martinsville tix were $60ish.

-To add on like 89' pointed out, big screen HD TVs with home theater surround. That started becoming big around the mid-late 00s. Attendance is down in across all the major sports I believe.
-NASCAR's most popular driver in the worst slump of his career 07'-10', missing the Chase all 4 years.

To add to the getting away from its roots (esp Southern):
-I remember seeing something a couple of years ago that a generation ago there were only 4 Sprint drivers not from the South. A couple years a go read there were only 4 drivers from the South.
-Not just being not being southern anymore but too corporate. Back in the day the drivers used to almost all sound like a bunch of good ol boys, JR is one of the few who still does somewhat. But now most of them sound to polished, well spoken, proper English, like Johnson.
-I'm sure changing the name from the Winston Cup to Nextel in 04' didn't sit well with a lot of old school fans.

Another thing I saw mentioned a year or 2 ago was pointed out that back in the 90s and earlier a lot of NASCAR fans were gearheads. Now the cars have gotten so computerized that there's not too many gearhead fans anymore..

[TheDancinMonarch]

When NASCAR was started by Bill France it was all about "the show". After they signed the national TV contracts in 2000 they seemed to try to make it about "the racing". That was "the" big mistake and the beginning of the decline and virtually every decision they have made since then was wrong.

[bluehenbillk]

Which will die first?
NASCAR or WNBA
discuss.

UD football

Ouch.

[93henfan]

UD football

Ouch.

The fanbase is hemorrhaging. The University president doesn't care about sports, especially football. The only bones they've thrown us in the past ten years are banners, handrails, and beer.

[BDKJMU]

Chase standings 1/2 way (13 races) through regular season for 16 driver/10 race Chase (notice are different than simple points standings):
1. Jimmy Johnson 436 pts, 2 wins
2. Joey Lagono 414 pts, 2 wins
3. Kevin Harvick 373 pts, 2 wins
4. Jeff Gordon 461 pts, 1 win
5. Karl Edwards 438 pts, 1 win
6. Dale Junior 439 pts, 1 win
7. Kyle Busch 411 pts, 1 win
8. Brad Keselowski 404 pts, 1 win
9. Denny Hamlin 379 pts, 1 win
10. Kurt Busch 241 pts, 1 win
11. Matt Kenseth 463 pts, 0 wins (points leader)
12. Kyle Larson 377 pts, 0 wins (rookie)
13. Ryan Neuman 374 pts, 0 wins
14. Brian Vickers 366 pts, 0 wins
15. Paul Menard 362 pts, 0 wins
16. Austin Dillon 358 pts, 0 wins (rookie)____________________________________________________________

17. Greg Biffle 357
18. Clint Bowyer 350
19 Kasey Kahne 349
20. Aric Almirola 344 pts
21. AJ Allmendinger 337 pts
22. Tony Stewart 336 pts
23. Marcus Ambrose 331
24. Jamie McMurray 317 pts
25. Casey Mears 301 pts
26. Martin Truex 289
27. Ricky Stenhouse 261
28. Danica Patrick 239
29. Justin Allgaier 223 (rookie)
30. Michael Annett 188 (rookie)
31 Cole Whitt 181 (rookie)
32. David Gilliland 175
33. Reed Sorenson 165
34. David Ragan 158
35. Alex Bowman 156 (rookie)
No other drivers have started all 13 races.....
http://www.nascar.com/en_us/sprint-cup- ... dings.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[89Hen]

12. Kyle Larson 377 pts, 0 wins (rookie)
27. Ricky Stenhouse 261 (rookie)
28. Danica Patrick 239
29. Justin Allgaier 223 (rookie)
30. Michael Annett 188 (rookie)
31 Cole Whitt 181 (rookie)
35. Alex Bowman 156 (rookie)

One of these things is not like the other.

[tribe_pride]

Chase standings 1/2 way (13 races) through regular season for 16 driver/10 race Chase (notice are different than simple points standings):
1. Jimmy Johnson 436 pts, 2 wins
2. Joey Lagono 414 pts, 2 wins
3. Kevin Harvick 373 pts, 2 wins
4. Jeff Gordon 461 pts, 1 win
5. Karl Edwards 438 pts, 1 win
6. Dale Junior 439 pts, 1 win
7. Kyle Busch 411 pts, 1 win
8. Brad Keselowski 404 pts, 1 win
9. Denny Hamlin 379 pts, 1 win
10. Kurt Busch 241 pts, 1 win
11. Matt Kenseth 463 pts, 0 wins (points leader)
12. Kyle Larson 377 pts, 0 wins (rookie)
13. Ryan Neuman 374 pts, 0 wins
14. Brian Vickers 366 pts, 0 wins
15. Paul Menard 362 pts, 0 wins
16. Austin Dillon 358 pts, 0 wins____________________________________________________________________

17. Greg Biffle 357
18. Clint Bowyer 350
19 Kasey Kahne 349
20. Aric Almirola 344 pts
21. AJ Allmendinger 337 pts
22. Tony Stewart 336 pts
23. Marcus Ambrose 331
24. Jamie McMurray 317 pts
25. Casey Mears 301 pts
26. Martin Truex 289
27. Ricky Stenhouse 261 (rookie)
28. Danica Patrick 239
29. Justin Allgaier 223 (rookie)
30. Michael Annett 188 (rookie)
31 Cole Whitt 181 (rookie)
32. David Gilliland 175
33. Reed Sorenson 165
34. David Ragan 158
35. Alex Bowman 156 (rookie)
No other drivers have started all 13 races.....
http://www.nascar.com/en_us/sprint-cup- ... dings.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Think you meant to put Dillon as Rookie as opposed to Stenhouse.