Thank you coal!

[AZGrizFan]

"Leans left", Just like George Soros (one of it's major benefactors) "leans left".

Everything is not linked to agencies like the Treasury or the Dept. of Education. Much of it is linked to extreme left-wing groups like Think Progress, Environmental Law Foundation, Citizens for Tax Justice, and Climate Progress, as well as, many many others.

SourceWatch was created to lie, period. It presents viewpoints from extremists and tries to shape and spin it into the mainstream as legitimate "news".

As has been said before (without you providing any proof to the contrary), please show us the "subsidies" that Big Oil receives that other companies like Google or Apple don't. Besides, if "Big Oil" receives so much money from the feds, it should be easily traceable in the Federal Budget. Please go look and show us what you find. I just can't wait to see it.

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

I see what the problem is here. Where you're mistaken is thinking that anybody give a crap what your original point was. That's not how this place works.

[kalm]

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

I see what the problem is here. Where you're mistaken is thinking that anybody give a crap what your original point was. That's not how this place works.

Shut up Z!

[AZGrizFan]

I see what the problem is here. Where you're mistaken is thinking that anybody give a crap what your original point was. That's not how this place works.

Shut up Z!

Just tryin' to give a fella some worldly advice from a guy who's rapidly approaching 40,000 posts.

[GannonFan]

"Leans left", Just like George Soros (one of it's major benefactors) "leans left".

Everything is not linked to agencies like the Treasury or the Dept. of Education. Much of it is linked to extreme left-wing groups like Think Progress, Environmental Law Foundation, Citizens for Tax Justice, and Climate Progress, as well as, many many others.

SourceWatch was created to lie, period. It presents viewpoints from extremists and tries to shape and spin it into the mainstream as legitimate "news".

As has been said before (without you providing any proof to the contrary), please show us the "subsidies" that Big Oil receives that other companies like Google or Apple don't. Besides, if "Big Oil" receives so much money from the feds, it should be easily traceable in the Federal Budget. Please go look and show us what you find. I just can't wait to see it.

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

Well, the thing that Google and Apple, and millions of other businesses that aren't energy concerns have to do with it, is that you tend to lump simple accounting rules, like the ability to depreciate capital equipment over the life of the equipment, as subsidies and some nefarious plot by the energy companies to get a free ride. Kinda like when guys like you start saying that anything relating to road infrastructure or the military are subsidies as well, to only the energy companies of course. The reality, is, that there are very little subsidies that flow only to the energy companies, and they don't amount to a large amount of dollars. Of course, that's why people resort to calling the entirety of the defense budget as a subsidy to energy (and energy alone) because the actual facts don't tend to support their claims.

[AZGrizFan]

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

Well, the thing that Google and Apple, and millions of other businesses that aren't energy concerns have to do with it, is that you tend to lump simple accounting rules, like the ability to depreciate capital equipment over the life of the equipment, as subsidies and some nefarious plot by the energy companies to get a free ride. Kinda like when guys like you start saying that anything relating to road infrastructure or the military are subsidies as well, to only the energy companies of course. The reality, is, that there are very little subsidies that flow only to the energy companies, and they don't amount to a large amount of dollars. Of course, that's why people resort to calling the entirety of the defense budget as a subsidy to energy (and energy alone) because the actual facts don't tend to support their claims.

Please show me ONE time where we've EVER let actual facts get in the way of a good argument here?

[GannonFan]

Well, the thing that Google and Apple, and millions of other businesses that aren't energy concerns have to do with it, is that you tend to lump simple accounting rules, like the ability to depreciate capital equipment over the life of the equipment, as subsidies and some nefarious plot by the energy companies to get a free ride. Kinda like when guys like you start saying that anything relating to road infrastructure or the military are subsidies as well, to only the energy companies of course. The reality, is, that there are very little subsidies that flow only to the energy companies, and they don't amount to a large amount of dollars. Of course, that's why people resort to calling the entirety of the defense budget as a subsidy to energy (and energy alone) because the actual facts don't tend to support their claims.

Please show me ONE time where we've EVER let actual facts get in the way of a good argument here?

I agree, it is the politics board for a reason.

[AZGrizFan]

Please show me ONE time where we've EVER let actual facts get in the way of a good argument here?

I agree, it is the politics board for a reason.

And it's the political board during the OFFSEASON....even worse.

[kalm]

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

Well, the thing that Google and Apple, and millions of other businesses that aren't energy concerns have to do with it, is that you tend to lump simple accounting rules, like the ability to depreciate capital equipment over the life of the equipment, as subsidies and some nefarious plot by the energy companies to get a free ride. Kinda like when guys like you start saying that anything relating to road infrastructure or the military are subsidies as well, to only the energy companies of course. The reality, is, that there are very little subsidies that flow only to the energy companies, and they don't amount to a large amount of dollars. Of course, that's why people resort to calling the entirety of the defense budget as a subsidy to energy (and energy alone) because the actual facts don't tend to support their claims.

Forgive me for painting with brush strokes if I have, but please indicate where I've done any of these things.

Regarding direct subsidies, a link would be helpful. Especially one that compares renewable subsidies versus coal and oil.

[Baldy]

"Leans left", Just like George Soros (one of it's major benefactors) "leans left".

Everything is not linked to agencies like the Treasury or the Dept. of Education. Much of it is linked to extreme left-wing groups like Think Progress, Environmental Law Foundation, Citizens for Tax Justice, and Climate Progress, as well as, many many others.

SourceWatch was created to lie, period. It presents viewpoints from extremists and tries to shape and spin it into the mainstream as legitimate "news".

As has been said before (without you providing any proof to the contrary), please show us the "subsidies" that Big Oil receives that other companies like Google or Apple don't. Besides, if "Big Oil" receives so much money from the feds, it should be easily traceable in the Federal Budget. Please go look and show us what you find. I just can't wait to see it.

Well we were talking about coal in this thread and my original point was to Leadbolt regarding his complaint about clean energy subsidies.

So here's a link straight from the sourcewatch article to the Dep. of Energy regarding a report on coal subsidies.

I'm sure big oil doesn't get any, not that Google or Apple have anything to do with it.

Why are you in favor of government picking winners and losers.

Government picking winners and losers...why not, it's the "progressive" thing to do.

[ChickenMan]

Government picking winners and losers...why not, it's the "progressive" thing to do.

There are no winners or losers with the progressive agenda.. they want us all (except for them) to be equally miserable.

[GannonFan]

Well, the thing that Google and Apple, and millions of other businesses that aren't energy concerns have to do with it, is that you tend to lump simple accounting rules, like the ability to depreciate capital equipment over the life of the equipment, as subsidies and some nefarious plot by the energy companies to get a free ride. Kinda like when guys like you start saying that anything relating to road infrastructure or the military are subsidies as well, to only the energy companies of course. The reality, is, that there are very little subsidies that flow only to the energy companies, and they don't amount to a large amount of dollars. Of course, that's why people resort to calling the entirety of the defense budget as a subsidy to energy (and energy alone) because the actual facts don't tend to support their claims.

Forgive me for painting with brush strokes if I have, but please indicate where I've done any of these things.

Regarding direct subsidies, a link would be helpful. Especially one that compares renewable subsidies versus coal and oil.

It's okay, I forgive you.

[kalm]

Forgive me for painting with brush strokes if I have, but please indicate where I've done any of these things.

Regarding direct subsidies, a link would be helpful. Especially one that compares renewable subsidies versus coal and oil.

It's okay, I forgive you.

Thought so...

[kalm]

Government picking winners and losers...why not, it's the "progressive" thing to do.

There are no winners or losers with the progressive agenda.. they want us all (except for them) to be equally miserable.

Do they?

Teddy Roosevelt, all those mid-west farmers, and Nick Hanauer would like to have a word with you.

[Grizalltheway]

Government picking winners and losers...why not, it's the "progressive" thing to do.

There are no winners or losers with the progressive agenda.. they want us all (except for them) to be equally miserable.

And all conks want children to go to work or starve if they have deadbeat parents, take away sufferage for women and minorities, and kill all puppies that aren't cute enough.

Boy, this is fun!

[Baldy]

There are no winners or losers with the progressive agenda.. they want us all (except for them) to be equally miserable.

Do they?

Teddy Roosevelt, all those mid-west farmers, and Nick Hanauer would like to have a word with you.

Cool story, but Amazon and Microsoft made Hanauer a rich man.

[mainejeff]

Thank-you coal!

[kalm]

Do they?

Teddy Roosevelt, all those mid-west farmers, and Nick Hanauer would like to have a word with you.

Cool story, but Amazon and Microsoft made Hanauer a rich man.

And....?

[Baldy]

Cool story, but Amazon and Microsoft made Hanauer a rich man.

And....?

Stock options for the middle class!

[89Hen]

Obama is at least pretending to lower the debt.

Agreed

[BDKJMU]

In Kalm's world and that of fellow liberals of his ilk, govt not confiscating as much $$ from an entity as they think it should somehow is twisted to equal govt spending and therefore subsidies..

[kalm]

In Kalm's world and that of fellow liberals of his ilk, govt not confiscating as much $$ from an entity as they think it should somehow is twisted to equal govt spending and therefore subsidies..

Companies and industries gaining tax advantages over other companies and industries through campaign funding and promises of future employment for politicians and staffers is a form of subsidy.

[HI54UNI]

Update

Total for month of August:

Actual production was 0.611% of total energy requirements (kWh) out of potential for 16% of total energy requirements.

[kalm]

Update:

All those progressives who control government in OK, Kansas, and Texas love wind...well they used to. Until the lobbyists took over.

"Free market conservatives "…

https://news.yahoo.com/decade-welcoming ... 11568.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[HI54UNI]

September Numbers

Wind Potential 19.62% of requirements
Wind Actual 4.45% of requirements

[Grizalltheway]

Interesting read on the pros/cons, challenges and backlash from pepes like HI5 on the subject.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/14/scien ... 22%7D&_r=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;