Ibanez wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:05 am
∞∞∞ wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2020 7:56 pm
Eh, even the Jacobin elites from the French Revolution are heavily criticized while we somehow deified our guys.
I guess you could say America had to have been made so better Republics and Democracies could be made afterwards. Assuming the FF were actually going for ideals (instead of practical matters regarding slavery, keeping their wealth, status, etc.), maybe they could've laid better groundwork had they access to practical political philosophies (ex. Hegel).
But even as men of their time, they were mostly rich white dudes who were angry that they weren't even richer. The East India Company f*cked up (again) as it looted the world and the FF were just mad that Britain had to tax them for it to make up funds...an early example of the inherent greed in capitalism and corporations, and how they tear society when left to their own devices.
You think many of those landowners were actually wealthy? The Virginia planting class was notoriously stretched thin and lived off credit until they could sell their crops and BARLEY make a profit. Were some of the FF wealthy planters, lawyers,etc... yes.
Also - it sounds like you disagree with their complaint that they should have representation. Are you suggesting that men of means can't feel disenfranchised?
No, I'm not suggesting that. But their feeling of disenfranchisement was at the cost of a lot of peoples disenfranchisement.
Let's not immortalize the FF as saviors when they did it primarily to benefit themselves under the guise of liberty, while throwing every other person (blacks, Natives, women, the lesser educated, etc) under the bus. Hell they even wrote into the Constitution a safeguard to protect themselves from a Presidential result just in case they didn't agree with it, divided the Legislative branch so it didn't have as much power, made sure only certain people could cote, and of course continued with slavery.
I get it, they were men of their times and every system has imperfections. To their credit, they kickstarted the idea of freedom and liberty, but the first take isn't often the best take. There's since been better political philosophies and governments we can emulate and improve upon which actually fall in line with the ideals of the American experiment. Let's stop clinging to the past.